Snarkpit Forum Index » General Banter » Smoking ban
Smoking ban
« previous page 1
2
3
...
4 next page »
Post Reply
Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Crono on Wed Mar 31st at 2:09am 2004

....Then why wouldn't you extend that mentality into other area's, Orph?

Such as this: Does it make the police immoral for pulling over drivers who don't wear seatbelts, since that can be self-destructive?

It's not the same exact situation, but, still. I think that you shouldn't smoke at your workplace, I don't think you should force your workers, who really don't have a choice in their own eyes, to potentially damage themselves further. However, I would hope that an encouragement towards quitting would be best ... but I know that doesn't happen.

But as you guys are saying all this I find the exact opposite happens. People give me s**t for NOT smoking. Also if I ask someone to really think about what they're doing they lash out at me. I've never met anyone who smoked and wasn't touchy about the subject ... well personally anyway. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Orpheus on Wed Mar 31st at 2:26am 2004

crono, i drive for a living, its unwise to make comments about the subject offhandedly.

seatbelts are a law, yes, but they kill almost as many people as they save, not a very good comparison on your part, cause cigarettes always kill, given a person doesn't die from another cause first.

i have my subjects, i chose them poorly by manys opinions, but i fight them to the end.

i think all work places should be smoke free, but if accommodations are not provided for, the workplace is being negligent in their duties, afterall, most hired the employee's knowing they smoked beforehand.

even if the point escaped the employers notice, is no excuse to discriminate.

anywhos' as usual i can see both viewpoints having merits.. its just smoking has so few thats the problem.

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Monqui on Wed Mar 31st at 2:28am 2004

I smoke occationally, I'll admit it. I mostly either do it outside, or in my own car. I only light up in front of friends if they don't mind- if they do, I put it out immediatly.

I think that it should be banned in public buildings and such (like in my dorm- which it is (banned, that is)), since it makes them reek for everyone. Hell, I don't even like the way my own hand smells after smoking. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Orpheus on Wed Mar 31st at 2:36am 2004

? posted by Monqui
I smoke occationally, I'll admit it. I mostly either do it outside, or in my own car. I only light up in front of friends if they don't mind- if they do, I put it out immediatly.

quit then, i know its not what you want to hear, or secretly you might agree, but the benefits far outweigh the alternatives.

i miss my cigs, i would miss my ability to breathe far more.

my only concern? is that i die of another incident, and miss out on years of enjoying them. as absurd as it sounds, i truly enjoyed smoking, i was never addicted to them, not in a way anyone would comprehend anyways.. quitting was not hard because of any withdrawal process, in fact there were none of note... i miss them like one would a favorite meal, or soft drink.. anywhos thats a different subject entirely, and could be considered promotional toward cigs.. which i strongly advise against..

i need to crash for the night guys, i have a run up to south bend indiana to do in the morning..

night all, be good

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by fishy on Wed Mar 31st at 2:57am 2004

? posted by Monqui

I smoke occationally, I'll admit it. I mostly either do it outside, or in my own car.

Hell, I don't even like the way my own hand smells after smoking.

the first bit seems strange to me. being a comparitively heavy smoker for my size, the one place that i would single out where i find smoking annoying is in a car. whether it's me or someone else thats doing the smoking. and as they banned using mobile phones while driving, they should do the same with smoking. but thats another matter.

as for the second bit of the quote, you'll always find an alternative if you quit. Orph did.

*scratch*scratch*





Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Crono on Wed Mar 31st at 3:00am 2004

? quote:
crono, i drive for a living, its unwise to make comments about the subject offhandedly.

seatbelts are a law, yes, but they kill almost as many people as they save, not a very good comparison on your part, cause cigarettes always kill, given a person doesn't die from another cause first.

i have my subjects, i chose them poorly by manys opinions, but i fight them to the end.

i think all work places should be smoke free, but if accommodations are not provided for, the workplace is being negligent in their duties, afterall, most hired the employee's knowing they smoked beforehand.

even if the point escaped the employers notice, is no excuse to discriminate.

anywhos' as usual i can see both viewpoints having merits.. its just smoking has so few thats the problem.


I think you completly missed what I was saying

If you didn't notice we were agreeing. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Monqui on Wed Mar 31st at 5:21am 2004

? quote:

? posted by Monqui
the first bit seems strange to me. being a comparitively heavy smoker for my size, the one place that i would single out where i find smoking annoying is in a car. whether it's me or someone else thats doing the smoking. and as they banned using mobile phones while driving, they should do the same with smoking. but thats another matter.

as for the second bit of the quote, you'll always find an alternative if you quit. Orph did.

*scratch*scratch*



I don't think holding something is quite on par with focusing your attention away from safe driving by carrying on a conversation with someone who's not even really there...

But mabye that's just me

I don't do it as a true regular habit though- it's more of a "I just failed a test, I need to unwind" kind of a thing- I, on average, mabye have 4-5 a week... (sometimes more, depending on what I'm doing (i.e. at pool halls, I smoke like a chimney. Mostly because all my friends who go out and play pool with me do it too. I'm a sheep, what can I say.))

And I totally know what orph is talking about with the not being quite addicted, but not wanting to give it up. I can go days without it, with no real ill physical side effects (cravings, headaches, that whole bit)- but it just feels... weird, I suppose is a good word... to think about going long periods of time without doing it. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Cassius on Wed Mar 31st at 6:13am 2004

It smells bad, it's addictive, annoying, disruptive, and it gives you and others around you cancer.

Smoking: Always a solid choice.





Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by scary_jeff on Wed Mar 31st at 9:35am 2004

? quote:
but discrimination, no matter the good intentions, is still wrong.


Orph, after some of our other discussions round here, that seems a bit meaningless coming from you...

Smoking in a car isn't just 'holding something', you still have to find the box, open the box, take out of box, find lighter, use lighter, then finally 'just hold'. I don't think theres any reason to not ban smoking while driving given that they have banned mobile phones while driving. You say that talking on the phone takes your concentration away from driving - how much more concentration does it take than talking to somebody who is sitting behind you? (not that I don't think it's a bad idea to ban mobile phones while driving - doing so obviously makes people crash more, I'm just trying to say that they banned mobile phones while driving here, and they don't seem to require much more concentration than smoking does, so why not ban that as well)

It's all well and good saying there should be a place set aside for smoking, but for most small companies, this isn't really practical is it. They are hardly going to build an extension for workers to smoke in, and it makes just as little sense to set an existing room aside, because that room could otherwise be used for something that helps the company. I think it's much easier to just make a workplace a 'no smoking area', then tell people this when they apply to work there.

I certainly don't dislike a person just because they smoke, not at all, but I do wish they would quit. I don't know if they have the same kind of anti-smoking advertising in america as they do here, but ugh... I honestly don't understand why somebody would continue after seeing things like that. I understand that it's not jsut a case of deciding not to smoke anymore, and that's it - my step dad has been trying to quit, and it has been very hard for him - but the way I see it, the dubious benifits of smoking are totally meaningless compared to the potential consequences. Not to mention the amount of money that has to be spent treating smokers in hospitals - the non-smoking public have to pay for all that as well as put up with the general nastyness of smoking itself.

? quote:
seatbelts are a law, yes, but they kill almost as many people as they save


Erm, what? Wheres the figures for this? I don't believe this for one second.



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Orpheus on Wed Mar 31st at 10:14am 2004

figures jeff? i advise, don't challenge me on this one, cause i know i am right this time

seatbelt do in fact kill, very often in fact, much more frequently than airbags and other safety devices.

if it truly means that much to you, google search it out, or just be wise this time and take my word for it..

call it job related experience, it goes with the territory of my profession.

for the record, i use my seat belt.

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Adam Hawkins on Wed Mar 31st at 10:18am 2004

I'm a strict non-smoker myself, but I don't mind others smoking...it's their choice.

What I do mind however, is inconsiderate smokers - it really doesn't take that much effort to blow the smoke in the opposite direction, or go outside etc (depending on the social circumstances).

If they want to kill themselves, then so be it, just don't take me down with you

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by KoRnFlakes on Wed Mar 31st at 10:29am 2004

if you choose to smoke, dont expect people to pay for places for you to go and bloody do it. if nobody smokes, it would be fine to outlaw it entirely, but people have become addicted to it, its become a macho symbol & god knows what. You couldnt ban it if you wanted to. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Orpheus on Wed Mar 31st at 10:35am 2004

? posted by KoRnFlakes
if you choose to smoke, dont expect people to pay for places for you to go and bloody do it. if nobody smokes, it would be fine to outlaw it entirely, but people have become addicted to it, its become a macho symbol & god knows what. You couldnt ban it if you wanted to.

i won't even comment on your first statement, but the same driving force, that keeps us using fossil fuels will keep us a smoking world. you could easier ban it and succeed, than fight the companies producing them.

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Leperous on Wed Mar 31st at 11:18am 2004

Maybe in the US, but not here in the UK! I think smoking should definitely be phased out- a good place to start would be to up the smoking age, to try and stop kids from taking it up.



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by OtZman on Wed Mar 31st at 12:17pm 2004

Why smoke? It's bad for the health and for the wallet.

I think anyone can do whatever they want as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. Smoking tends to hurt others... I think this law sounds like a good thing.

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Gwil on Wed Mar 31st at 12:31pm 2004

Common misconceptions

Everyone who smokes is addicted, and doesnt enjoy it - not true
Everyone who smokes is filthy and inconsiderate - not true

This should be a discussion on the social issue and tackling smoking in youngsters, and preventing passive smoking not an "i hate smokers thread"..

Also, many seem to forget (UK this applies to) that smoking tax (about ?3.50 of a ?4.50 odd box is tax) goes straight to the NHS, and in total for the whole country it adds up to around ?7/8bn in extra cash for the health service. But stop! I hear you cry, this is all money that will probably used to treat cancer, which is caused by smoking.

Maybe so, but in small numbers. The idea that smoking causes everybody guaranteed cancer, passive or otherwise is absurd. As I said before, the figure is only in the thousands for those who die from passive smoking, so trying to portray it as an evil force out to destroy "the norms" is just unfair and uninformed.

Raising the price won't affect things either, smoking is usually taken up at an early age in areas like mine (lower/middle class) - price doesnt bother anyone who is a smoker (any age), they will still buy cigarettes. Tackling smoking is about educating people to the effects it has on your body, and limiting peer pressure/media pressure to smoke. Also one might consider who smokes, and why - looking at working conditions and poverty lines will probably reveal some very interesting findings.

Banning smoking outright in public will only get smoking voters disaffected and angry, and lose a hell of a lot of revenue for the government. For a Government who like to be seen as pro civil liberties and pro-business, you need much more thoughtful and directed policies than "ban" or "raise prices". Like pretty much everything they do, it would be a case of fill the cracks but never maintenance the underlying problem. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Gwil on Wed Mar 31st at 12:33pm 2004

? quote:
Why smoke? It's bad for the health and for the wallet.

I think anyone can do whatever they want as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. Smoking tends to hurt others... I think this law sounds like a good thing.


Bad for the wallet, because of high taxes. Every government who taxes cigarettes (or other products for that matter) to death, only exacerbates illegal trade problems in that area. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Cassius on Thu Apr 1st at 12:52am 2004

Give me one legitimate reason that smoking should be considered a respectable choice, much less a positive one.



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Gwil on Thu Apr 1st at 1:14am 2004

It's just a part of culture (in many societies, not just ours) - it may have a new spin on it now with media and business involvement, but tobacco smoking always has been and always will be an indulgence and luxury for some. It's been going on for years.

Remember also, "smoking" does not equate to cigarettes in the context of this topic. Cigars, pipes and whatever else are all forms of smoking, common no doubt in Ireland. To dismiss an entire element of culture would be foolish, to say the least.

I never said it was or wasn't respectable, the respect is about accepting freedom of choice and diversity of lifestyles, sir.



Quote
 Re: Smoking ban
Posted by Cash Car Star on Thu Apr 1st at 2:13am 2004

? posted by Orpheus

but discrimination, no matter the good intentions, is still wrong.

I'm not even gonna touch the hypocrisy of that statement from you. Oops. Too late.






« previous page 1
2
3
...
4 next page »
Post Reply