Snarkpit Forum Index » General Banter » r_speeds limit
r_speeds limit
« previous page 1
2
3
...
456 next page »
Post Reply
Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by matt on Sat Apr 3rd at 3:54pm 2004

whats a polygone?



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Wild Card on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:02pm 2004

*slap* [addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by KungFuSquirrel on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:16pm 2004

? quote:
the halflife engine can ONLY draw 1000 wpolies tops, from that point on, its entirely hardware related, but no matter how much hardware you have, there will always be some noticeable issues.


Software mode is limited to 800 polys. Once you get into a 3D rendering mode, no such limit exists. There is no set threshold at 1000. Once you get past about 60-75 fps most people can't even tell a difference in refresh rates, and most of those who claim they can are full of s**t anyway. Running 1200+ wpoly at 1600x1200 32bit color with multiple detailed models and high resolution skins also loaded and displaying at 100fps (essentially off the scale) leaves HL open to some serious power on high-end machines (at least for a game this old). [addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:23pm 2004

then, my pc is s**t, cause i notice choppiness, on almost any map over 1000 r's

you know what, perhaps its my limitations and not the games, cause i can't play much over a half hour anyways.

when i see slideshow, its crap, and most times crap happens at or about 1000.

in all fairness, there are quirks, cause i have seen a couple maps, over 1200, that ran perfectly.. makes me wonder if epolies play a much stronger role than we give credence to.

all-in-all, my line is drawn at 1000, i still say its tolerance to crap, thats the deciding factor.. i have heard people claim to play just fine at 2500

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by fraggard on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:25pm 2004

I tend to agree with the 1000 limit. I just cannot believe that the engine can scale it's capabilities infinitely with GPU power. It's practically impossible for anyone to code for eventualities that far into the future :/



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:30pm 2004

there is always the possibility, that because machines are indeed so powerful now, that the r_speeds command is no longer accurate..

i mean i am positive that anything above 1000 causes choppiness, maybe when people say they are getting 75fps, the engine only says its 75.

i mean seriously, how could a 5 year old engine foresee 3 ghz processors.. wasn't the largest in the 500mhz area?

what if the code, that determines accurate fps readings, cannot handle the new hardware?

i just find it difficult to imagine my 2.6 as unable to cope.

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by KungFuSquirrel on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:32pm 2004

epolys can be especially variable on video cards - the texture memory in particular can be killer on some custom models. We plan to release a low-resolution skin pack for NW at release to help alleviate these problems.

Things such as regular entities can even affect this. While I'm not exactly for sure on performance hits as a result, overdraw could be one concern - overdraw being what happens when faces are drawn over each other, which is more expensive than drawing just individual faces (this would likely be a sufficient explanation as to why a map with 1000 wpoly and with no vis run would perform worse than a map with 1000 wpoly and a full vis - the no vis version would have a ton of stuff overlapping). With texture, additive, and solid render modes this of course is expected, but any brush entity will cause overdraw over whatever is behind it, which can be reduced by nulling not just entity backfaces, but the actual geometry behind brush entities (if it is reasonable to do so) - the way caulk actually was designed to work in the Quake 3 engine.

Intelligent design is still going to make a higher wpoly map better than it would be if it were poorly designed, and the optimizations and general construction techniques used by a more experienced mapper will keep things better in line. The key is being able to use the polys well, however many you're using.

I do really look forward to getting away from the HL engine entirely, though, the set poly limits and guidelines are really annoying Things like the Unreal engine's complexity view feature (which colors the scene from green to red based on complexity) and target framerate values (in HL2, for example) instead of target poly count values take all these other variables into consideration, and despite seeming more arbitrary, are far better at defining what will and won't perform well within a game engine. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by KungFuSquirrel on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:35pm 2004

? quote:
I just cannot believe that the engine can scale it's capabilities infinitely with GPU power. It's practically impossible for anyone to code for eventualities that far into the future :/


Well, it doesn't scale infinitely, but there's still more than enough power to display some hefty counts with newer hardware. It won't run as efficiently as the same polycount would in a newer game designed for those numbers, but it's still more than enough to get more than was originally designed out of it. [addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Andrei on Sat Apr 3rd at 4:52pm 2004

Long live VIS blocking .

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Yak_Fighter on Sat Apr 3rd at 5:42pm 2004

800 is the max. It's not really that hard to make good looking stuff at that liimit people. Anything beyond that and you're probably adding unnecessary details that no one will give a rat's ass about in the middle of a firefight.





Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Sat Apr 3rd at 6:42pm 2004

I look at it this way: If you wanted a lot of detail and polys in your maps, then you wouldn't be mapping for Half-Life (a glorified 4+ year old Quake 1 engine?) R_speeds are always going to be a major part of Half-Life maps, and it's just plain laziness to discard them. I voted for 1000; that's really the absolute limit in my eyes. Believe it or not, I actually somewhat enjoy the challenge of creating as much as possible within the limits.

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Adam Hawkins on Sat Apr 3rd at 10:31pm 2004

I try my best to stay below 1000, though inevitably my r_speeds sometimes creep above it a touch. 1000 is definitely my ideal limit though - especially if I want my maps to be played regardless of what system people have

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Apr 3rd at 10:32pm 2004

the fact, that some dingbat (wonders if dingbat is another UK cussword )wasted a vote, by selecting the 5000 option, tells me we have little real use for a polling system

seems to me, that if its that unimportant to someone, why bother :/

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by scary_jeff on Sat Apr 3rd at 10:35pm 2004

Hah, a dingbat just means a fool here. It looks like that's what it means over there too I think it's an australian word?



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Apr 3rd at 10:37pm 2004

? posted by scary_jeff
Hah, a dingbat just means a fool here. It looks like that's what it means over there too I think it's an australian word?

isn't it cool in a way, that a word, that is as semi-obscure as dingbat, works on both sides of the pond

someday, we, all of snarkpit, needs to post words.. not common ones, but words like dingbat, and compare notes.. i think that thread could be very informative

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by scary_jeff on Sat Apr 3rd at 10:53pm 2004

Hah, I've got one, I was watching a film and this new york cabby called someone 'mac'. I laughed so hard, I had forgotten that anybody said this... is it something people in other parts of america would say? Do new york cabbies still (did they ever) say that in reality? I know how easy it is to get a completely false impression of a place from films.

I just find the concept of saying 'hey mac, get outa here' really funny for some reason. Here, a mac is a raincoat, but people don't use 'mac' very much any more.



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Apr 3rd at 10:58pm 2004

i do not use the term/word as such, but it is actually used.

"hop in mac" is common enuff

its like dude, or the word dude.. it means "a city person attempting to be western" as in a "dude ranch"

its rarely used that way though, more than likely, it would be used in lieu of mac.. as in "hop in dude"

another term is "buddy" in truckers lingo, it means "homosexual"

[addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by scary_jeff on Sat Apr 3rd at 11:08pm 2004

LOL

That explains a bunch of movie lines. It never seemed to make sense to me that people would agressiveley call somebody 'buddy' - I mean it could be sarcasm, but somehow... no.

A while ago, we were flicking through the TV channels, and there was this awful 70s film about some plane passengers who were stranded on an island. We watched it because it had 'lando' from star wars in it. Lando had a fight with some guy (I'ts probably just me, but the whole idea of a young 'lando' running around a jungle was just hilarious to me... I can't seperate the actor from the carachter lando), then afterwards was arguing with some other guy, and ended with 'yeah, real nice BUDDY' (buddy in caps because he said it with such force). Now it didn't make sense to me that he had such an aggressive tone, but was only calling the guy his 'buddy'. Now it all makes sense

Well, that was a nice post wasn't it, hope it makes some kind of sense.



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Gwil on Sat Apr 3rd at 11:10pm 2004

That's the problem You can't begin to sit and define cultural differences in words because of subcultures developed, and developing.

It really is a grey area - something to celebrate really, there is such a vast range of dialects in the world it makes living unique from counties and towns [addsig]



Quote
 Re: r_speeds limit
Posted by Gwil on Sat Apr 3rd at 11:11pm 2004

That's true Jeff, I always thought it sounded odd... almost sarcastic but not quite. It clicks [addsig]




« previous page 1
2
3
...
456 next page »
Post Reply