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Funny things that happen while i drive.
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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by DrGlass on Fri Jan 21st at 7:41pm 2005

? quote:
It may sound cold, but I don't think the government should support people who are too short sighted to plan for their own futures.



Not all people fail to have money when they retire becuase they are short sighted. There are so many factors that could lead to a lack of money when old age comes about. Alot of familys need every penny they earn just to get by. Putting an end to s.s. wont curb younger people to save more for old age. In fact I would venture to guess that it would cost everyone alot more if s.s. were to be cut out of the system. Think of all the people who would apply for welfare?

I think that the government should reward thoughs who invest their money and save for their old age with tax cuts. If you fund your own retirment I dont think you should have to pay as much to fund another person's s.s.




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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Tracer Bullet on Fri Jan 21st at 7:50pm 2005

? quoting DrGlass


I think that the government should reward thoughs who invest their money and save for their old age with tax cuts. If you fund your own retirment I dont think you should have to pay as much to fund another person's s.s.

SS does not work that way. If it is to continue unchanged, everyone has to pay, whether they need it or not. What would happen, I ask you, if all the wealthy people stopped paying SS taxes? the system would collapse. It is not a retirement system. Benefits are paid by current tax payers, not the money each individual puts in over their lifetime. Don't you think it would be better if instead of paying social security taxes, everyone was required to save that same portion of their income for retirement? You wouldn't be changing anything in terms of realized income.

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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by DrGlass on Fri Jan 21st at 7:59pm 2005

Well yeah, that is true.

but bottom line is you cant tell the people what to do with their money.




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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Tracer Bullet on Fri Jan 21st at 8:00pm 2005

? quoting DrGlass
Well yeah, that is true.

but bottom line is you cant tell the people what to do with their money.

What do you call taxes? Free choice?

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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Orpheus on Fri Jan 21st at 8:06pm 2005

i didn't post this to start a debate on the pro's and con's of the tax system. my main point was to call attention to the numbers.. i do not believe there are that many well off people in this country. i drive a lot, i see slums everywhere. i do not think that they keep them around as a reminder of what can happen to you if you are neglectful. slums and poorer sections of the country are signs that this country is in trouble.

SS has a purpose, its not SS thats to blame for not doing its job, its the people borrowing from it to pay other things than its designed goal.

i have been paying SS for 20+ years, i will never see any return on that investment, and thats my only problem with it ATM..

i studied economics in school. its not the system, its the abusers of the system.

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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Tracer Bullet on Fri Jan 21st at 8:24pm 2005

I think this might interest you Orph: http://ferret.bls.census.gov/macro/032004/pov/new46_100125_01.htm

It seems that 12% of all Americans are below the "poverty line". You can look up what that is, but I didn't bother. By contrast, 18% of people in Akansas are defined as poor. At a quick glance, only New Mexico rates higher on that scale.

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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Mephs on Fri Jan 21st at 8:33pm 2005

Just to play Devil's Advocate, its in the best interests of western governments to allow the creation of new businesses (to the point where if, in the UK your business is deemed important to the economy, MI6 will actively help you in the international market) and they do generally have a lot of schemes, grants, information and loans to help you. I doubt that anyone here lacks the intellectual capacity to come up with an idea or even to fill a gap some market which would make a great business venture. But we don't. Personally, I'd put this down to the lack of drive and self-confidence I have, rather than the rich people taking steps to keep me down. Surely, in your government's eyes, the more big businesses, the merrier? In short, why the hell ARE'NT we all rolling in it?

* goes to set up his business...after Friends is over....actually, I'll watch that, then The Simpsons...
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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Nickelplate on Fri Jan 21st at 9:09pm 2005

? quoting Tracer Bullet
Don't even get me started on creation science... Those people are as bad as Jahzel!

To answer your question Orph, I live in a very affluent home. Upper middle class I guess you'd call it. My parents have "owned" a home for my whole life, and at this point, I think my Dad makes $100k+ per year. I don't expect that my parents will ever need SS, and I don't expect that I will either. It may sound cold, but I don't think the government should support people who are too short sighted to plan for their own futures. What I would like to see is a SS cutoff, where by everyone my age or younger never sees a penny, and then there is some sort of gradient so that the older you are (right now) the larger a percentage of your benefits will be paid. This way those who are already on social security won't get screwed, and my children won't have to pay for the damn system anymore. I realize that this sticks my generation with the bill for everyone older than ourselves, but I think it's a price that needs to be paid. I don't think that the system works, and if he government wants to provide for peoples retirements, it ought to mandate a certain percentage of savings for every citizen. That would be much more effective for individuals, better for the economy, and more efficient since it wouldn't involve a huge government bureaucracy.

I agree completely. I don't think the government should support anyone who does not work. If they want to "help" people they can give them money for like a month. If they do not have a job within a month then too bad. Cut off welfare and SS. Cut off disability. They disabled should have a family to care for them, if they have no living family, they can get a job screwing on toothpaste lids. look at what steven hawking does!!

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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by $loth on Fri Jan 21st at 9:44pm 2005

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they can get a job screwing on toothpaste lids. look at what steven hawking does!!



Thats just cold, not all disability's are physical.
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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Mephs on Sat Jan 22nd at 12:18am 2005

I agree. If you consider the fact that the people who make REAL money do no physical work whatsoever, its hard to jibe the disabled. Although a great mind and a poor body do not go together like some kind of Hollywood 'supercripple' (Hawking was a great thinker before the limits of his disability) in our developed world of machinery and information technology everyone has a role.

Nickleplate, you obviously are not at the age to, or due to your families wealth do not have to work. Everyone is out of work at some stage. Companies push and push the limits of their employees to increase the work of one man, and increase the ammount of unemployed. It makes financial sense, in a cold way. But I'm not even going to rise to your post's attention seeking nature (unless it was sarcasm, in which case this was a massive waste of typing. I hope so)
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 Re: Funny things that happen while i drive.
Posted by Nickelplate on Sat Jan 22nd at 1:40am 2005

Sorry, Didn't mean to come off sounding so cold.

Mephs, My parents are middle-class, But i do not rely on them. I do have a job and must pay for EVERYTHING of my own except supper some nights. I get charged rent, and i live in thier basement. I have a job at a school district as a computer networker that pays me $7.00 an hour and i work about 15-20 hrs a week. I also am taking 18 credit-hours of college in the next town over. while paying for ALL of this stuff, I still am not destitute, though I do not have much EXTRA money, I still ALREADY have a large savings account for when i am much older, It's not special 401k or "retirement plan" but if i keep saving the same amount every month that i am now, it will be enough so that i will not need SS. I'm not mad or anything, but i wanted to explain to you that I am not some 16-year-old who lives with mommy who pays for all my stuff. the only ties i even have to my parents is that i pay them rent for the use of thier basement.

Also, I know there are people who are classified as "profoundly retarded" who are not capable of even the most basic functions. I kinow that these unfortuante people also have very unfortunate parents that must take care of TWO people on the time it takes anyone else to take care of themselves. For people whose conditions are beyond thier control like retarded folks and psychotics and the like, I think some government help is in order. But these hillbillies where i live who are on disability for NO reason other than they fact that they want money should have something rEally bad happen to them.

[edit] yes some of the other post was uncolored sarcasm. mixed with me having a bad day.

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