Screw morality, let's get to the bottom of peoples' dislike for homosexuals: we, having been brought up with a more or less clear picture of what men should be like, react with disgust when we see deviation from that pattern - or, even worse, dissent against it. I'm not saying it's wrong to have that kind of reaction - for example, I don't have a problem with homosexuals as people, of course, but to me, more 'flamboyant' expressions of homosexuality are not the most pleasant sight. Hell, when reading that description of men walking into battles with their gay lovers, I winced a little. It's a fairly normal reaction, I think, if only because that's how we're raised, but one we have to see past in order to treat people how they deserve to be treated - as our equals. I also think that it is more than wrong to construe that kind of reaction as somehow logical, and to dignify it with the title of 'morality.' You wouldn't say that it's wrong to oppose racism because a lot of people were deeply, morally racist for much of human history, no matter how they adopted their opinions - no matter if they were "raised, taught, or indoctrinated" to believe them.

There are a few gays at my school, and there's no more wrong with them than there is with anybody. It might upset me if I saw them going at it, sure, but that's just because of the culture I was raised in.

And yes, "homophobia" is a terrible misnomer. I got a "bad rap," as it were, at my school after publicly saying, during an assembly on bullying, these words: "Saying 'oh my God' doesn't make you religious; saying 'that's gay' doesn't make you homophobic." It's pretty ridiculous and petty to belittle your opposition not by logical argument, but to claim they're just afraid of you on the inside.

They're not flaunting s**t, and if they are, that's their choice. Again, see past your disgust and see them as equals.

They need to make thier lambdas out of gigantic penises. then we can tell the difference.

"gordon Freeman, please report to the giant phallic missile silo in the lambda sector!!"

like Orph, i was born into a generation that was fed on a whole different set of values than those of 'do whatever excites you' that are on offer today. that doesn't mean either of us want to round up gays and burn them in a pit. but no matter, we'd still be labled with, and afflicted by the same all pervasive phobia that affects any dissenters to the new creed, from the fire stokers to the pope. none of whos beliefs can be dignified with the title of 'morals', apparently.

i'm not against racism, but i am against people being treated unfairly. in simple terms, if i have a fondness for sex with a 30 stone black women, that's no-one elses business, but i should pay her the same as i would a white women.

Therefore you must support gay marriage. They deserve the same recognition and privilege that the rest of the society takes for granted.

My advice, for what its worth, if you do not want this thread/topic to degrade any further, find someone else's comments to use for an example to keep it going.

My views are not looked upon favorably, and no matter how tactful i reply, they will still be insulting to many.

I do not have any problems discussing the topic, but I do have a problem with people whom cannot accept that I have every right to believe exactly how I do.

So, lets please keep this civil, unless you are truly prepared for the outcome.

Cass, i think fish was making a joke. disregard the entire paragraph all except the last sentence.

at least, thats how i took it to mean.

in other words, its all pink on the inside and deserves equal pay.

[edit] with that said, /me is off to nite-nite land.

be good all

Actually, unless you've got MAJOR problems EVERYONE is pink on the inside! (for the most part.) But i still need someone to bash, and i still need someone to pick the materials for my textile mills. Until we can subvert the Vortigaunts I see no other option.

Actually i'm just f**kin' with you. I have a thing for asian women. what?