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Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Mon Oct 10th at 9:51pm 2005

Well my original plan with my buddy fell through so Im on my own. We couldnt decide on a map theme, and after playing a very crappy Black Hawk Down map on CS, I though I'd try and make an actual styled map. The one I played was simply a large deathmatch map, with no bomb point or hostages to rescue. The theme was really cheesy.

Would like some opinions on the idea.




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Addicted to Morphine on Mon Oct 10th at 10:30pm 2005

I think it would be a great hostage rescue, since the actual Black Hawk that was downed had survivors that were under siege awaiting a rescue. While hostage rescue maps aren't the most popular, I just think it makes the most sense given the scenario.

I think you should try for some sort of figure 8 layout... with the hostages and terrorists spawning in the middle, and perhaps 2 groups of CTs (alpha and bravo?) spawning at the top and bottom of the figure 8. I just think that the CT's should be able to approach from four different directions, and perhaps have enough cover to sneak around. Rubble near the crash site would be great (perhaps the Black Hawk plowed through a rooftop and second floor before breaking through the other side and skidding to a halt on the street?) and it would offer good cover and the rubble is something I loved from DoD. Otherwise the buildings in the level should be intact and inaccessible (except for perhaps a few key sniper spots?).

The problem with city maps is you don't want the player to get confused or lost. Vary the architecture and texturing, or provide some landmarks to help orient the player so that it only takes a few rounds to recognize the layout. Perhaps a larger mosque or something (not necessarily in the map, perhaps just in the 3D skybox) could serve as a landmark from with new players can orient themselves.

I think you should look up some images of Mogadishu for architectural references. I'm not sure where the movie was shot, but you can watch that for ideas.

I think you need to strike a good balance between realism and gameplay, between bare streets and too much cover. The level should require sweeping of corners, and checking behind rubble, but you shouldn't have to walk into an area and take fire from 10 different hidden enemies. The crash site could easily become a campfest, so make sure the Terrorists need to watch both the hostages and their backs.

That's all I've got for now, good luck!




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by rival on Mon Oct 10th at 10:36pm 2005

that is actually a very good idea.
im always inspired by some of the estates in my town. maybe ill make a few CSS maps later....


Bullet Control: $5000 for a bullet.
"I would blow your f**king head off! ...if I could afford it. I'm gonna get another job, start saving some money... then you a dead man!"



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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Captain P on Mon Oct 10th at 11:01pm 2005

Sounds good. If you can get a dusty, arabic city feeling to it, it may work really well for athmosphere.

As for the gameplay, I agree with Addicted to Morphine. It suits best for a cs_ map. But maybe it'd be a nice idea to spawn the CT's at the Black Hawk and the T's around them, dare I say an aim_ map... nah, perhaps mix up that idea with some other gameplay objective, like two reinforcement routes that the T's could block by blowing up stuff or such... maybe that's a nice different de_ objective?



Create-ivity - a game development blog



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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Tue Oct 11th at 12:35am 2005

I was thinking either a hostage rescue, or if it can be done, a CT bomb map. Where the CTs must bomb a downed Black Hawk. I think I'll go with hostage rescue though.

The next question is setting. With reference to the movie, Black Hawk Down, the are 2 missions. The first (situation 1), capture VIPs, and the second (situation 2), rescue the pilot of the downed helicopter. Im leanning more towards the downed Black Hawk.

Im trying to make the map as unique as possible. The problem is, Im way outdated on mapping. I built a Black Hawk heli out of brushes. But last time I was here I posted a pic of a Cessna I built and you guys told me to use a model instead.

Anyways, what I was thinking:

For situation 1: CTs spawn in 4 hovering Black Hawks at four corners of a building, just like the original mission. However, to make the map a little better, it wouldnt be the 4 corners of the building, but rather 4 intersections surrounding the building. Terrs spawn in the middle of the building, in an open area. Hostages are located in 2 seperate rooms on different floors.

For situation 2: 2 CTs start in a Black Hawk which is circling the crashed helicopter on the ground. There is only 1 hostage. The rest of the CTs start a few blocks away and the Terrorists spawn all over the Black Hawk, not just in a specific building. CTs in the Black Hawk, one is issues a Scout, the other, an M4. After a while, the Black Hawk will touch down near the crashed bird and the 2 CTs will arrive on site with the hostage. They should arrive there before the Terrs do. But not by much.

Terrs...........CTs
.............../
............./
.........../
.........hostage




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by FatStrings on Tue Oct 11th at 12:42am 2005

it would be cool if it was possible to make the hostages like low level bots that could only stay in that area
ct's- rescue them
t's- kill them




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by G4MER on Tue Oct 11th at 1:21am 2005

One of the games I liked a lot was... The Sum of All Fears.. it had some great level design in the game. I would try and get a demo, or the game its self and look at some of its levels and try to copy them.




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Tue Oct 11th at 1:24am 2005

I do have the game. Although I didnt like the gameplay. The Ghost Recon engine was never made for close quarter combat.

Right now, Im designing the Black Hawk, seeing as either way I go, I'll need at least one of those birds.

MS, good to see you buddy <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by G4MER on Tue Oct 11th at 1:29am 2005

yeah good to see you too.. I have been slowly working on my seige map.. its comin along but its slow.. as I am a noob at the new tools. It takes me a tad longer to figure stuff out than you youngins.. lol.

I am willing to try and help you with your map, make a section or something... once you get a good idea of what your doing..

Also try and get fishy to make you some models he is damn good at it. he made me a couple I have stashed away.. for a hotel 6/holiday inn map I am making also.

yeah i agree the game play was a bit lacking.. but the maps were nice... as I recall anyways.




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Tue Oct 11th at 1:35am 2005

I tryed to make a Hotel 6 map once <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif"> Boy did it ever look like a mix of Adams Familly and the abandoned house in Fight Club.

Thanks for offering the help. You'll be the first person I'll call on. Although for now, before even the first brush comes down, I need to decide which option Im going to go for.

I've got the heli almost completed, brush wise that is. Dont even ask about textures <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif"> The only problem Im having is getting those windows in the cockpit floor on either side of the instrument panel.. Their shape is very difficult to replicate in VHE.. Damn invalid solid errors.




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by G4MER on Tue Oct 11th at 1:38am 2005

you do know there is a Blackhawk model.. now where did I see that at? hummmm




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Tue Oct 11th at 1:41am 2005

I hate models... They make my work look so horrible.. The question is... can players stand in the model? Or manoeuver it like a func_train? Assuming HL2's func_train to be the same as HL1's




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by G4MER on Tue Oct 11th at 1:52am 2005

yes.. the boats and buggies in the HL2 game are all models.




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Tue Oct 11th at 1:58am 2005

Effing HL2.... Im too stuck in HL1 mapping. Well, I'll do without bloody model for this map. After that, I might just stick to enjoying the levels, not building them. I can only see a few years from now entire levels being one big model.

[EDIT] Added you to MSN by the way




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by G4MER on Tue Oct 11th at 2:04am 2005

Ok cool.. I just turned on my MSN.. yeah might be a better way to communicate or this thread may go way off topic, and besides haveing us with 40 back and forth replies.. lol




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by FatStrings on Tue Oct 11th at 2:05am 2005

or like a VIP
except like 3 VIP's that spawn at the crash site




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by G4MER on Tue Oct 11th at 2:07am 2005

Is this a HL1 or HL2 map? cause in HL2 there is no VIP.. damn it.




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by FatStrings on Tue Oct 11th at 2:13am 2005

im thinking cs




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Wild Card on Tue Oct 11th at 2:16am 2005

Counter Strike Source.

The only stupid thing will be having hostages in work clothes in a Somalian war-wrecked city...




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 Re: Black Hawk Down-style CS:S map
Posted by Dark Tree on Tue Oct 11th at 2:21am 2005

We all have imagination skills but much fewer of us have skinning skills. We'll live <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">.





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