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 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Thu Nov 10th at 6:21am 2005

Thanks. I just spent the night playing with bots in my map, and it's actually quite fun. I never thought that bots would pose enough of a threat to me, but I guess I was wrong.



"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Windows 98 on Thu Nov 10th at 8:24pm 2005

Bot suck, if you think bots are hard.... dont play online.


May I suggest makin a custom NAV file?



http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/8521/windows981dk.jpg

Nickelplate is my dad



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 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by parakeet on Thu Nov 10th at 8:55pm 2005

hey my clan does play quite a bit of css

www.arclan.net

you can email me the map at

vash.arclan@gmail.com

oh yeah windows .. bots are hard on a well made map with propper flow..

*just wanted to let yeh know <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">*



.else /me ~kill you
www.arclan.net



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Thu Nov 10th at 9:27pm 2005

I have personally wiped out the entire opposing team by myself with real players, so I can handle myself online.

But with so many sniping spots in my map, sometimes I get sniped without knowing where it came from. I am alwasy surprised that the bots found these sniping spots all by themselves.

How do you make/modify a .nav file?




"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by wil5on on Thu Nov 10th at 10:30pm 2005

If bots are in your map, theres already a nav file...

When you add bots into the game, it automatically generates the nav file if there is none (this usually takes a while). It automatically finds all the sniper spots, choke points etc. I forget what the console commands are to tweak it, you can get into a special nav editing mode in-game. Try the Valve wiki.




&quot;If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?&quot;
- My yr11 Economics teacher



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Thu Nov 10th at 11:12pm 2005

Yeah, I was pretty impressed at the process of generating the .nav file. It's quite amazing that it works so well without those info_nodes.


"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Windows 98 on Thu Nov 10th at 11:20pm 2005

Sorry about the pictures being missing, but I'm having him redo them soon. Its easy enough to follow without the pics I beleive.
http://csm2.net/forum/index.php/topic,1155.0.html

bassically the advantages to having a custom NAV is that the bots arnt so stupid, You can make them get to some pretty nifty spots. It's fun to make a maze map, the make it so like every corner is a sniping spot. Even if it isnt long, Because they try to AWP you even though they are like 2 feet away <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">.



http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/8521/windows981dk.jpg

Nickelplate is my dad



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Thu Nov 10th at 11:38pm 2005

Thanks Windows. That tutorial looks like some hardcore tuning.

[EDIT] I found this at the Valve wiki. It's quite useful too.

[EDIT2] Here is another useful forum for .nav file tuning. It's not easy to find, but I located it from many google searches.




"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by G4MER on Fri Nov 11th at 2:17am 2005

? quote:

www.arclan.net



DUDE THATS AN AWESOME WEB PAGE! I will stop by your servers sometime.




Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Fri Nov 11th at 3:25am 2005

Man, I just realized that there are whole communities on the internet that devote their energy to hand-tuning these .nav files for CS:S. It's almost like the SnarkPit, but they specialize in tweaking these bot navigation. It's almost like an art form.

The internet is a wonderful place.




"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by G4MER on Fri Nov 11th at 3:43am 2005

yes it is..




Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Windows 98 on Fri Nov 11th at 7:17pm 2005

That special like bot tuning forum is cool, ive been there before.

They also do map painting, which is always a nice touch. If you dont know what that it, its setting sections of your map to have a name on the radar.

like this

image



http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/8521/windows981dk.jpg

Nickelplate is my dad



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by G4MER on Fri Nov 11th at 9:46pm 2005

? quote:
That special like bot tuning forum is cool, ive been there before.

They also do map painting, which is always a nice touch. If you dont know what that it, its setting sections of your map to have a name on the radar.



How is that done?




Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Captain P on Fri Nov 11th at 9:57pm 2005

One or another entity, how else? <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif">



Create-ivity - a game development blog



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Naklajat on Fri Nov 11th at 10:00pm 2005

Nope :P You 'paint' the bot navigation mesh with place names. Like this.


=o



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Fri Nov 11th at 10:03pm 2005

I feel that .nav tuning is almost like a final step in CS:S mapping. It's virtually necessary for the bots to be intelligent in any custom map.

Kinda like buildcubemaps, except it's not just for appearance.




"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Naklajat on Fri Nov 11th at 10:05pm 2005

? quote:

? quote:

www.arclan.net

DUDE THATS AN AWESOME WEB PAGE! I will stop by your servers sometime.

Seconded. I liek teh revolver.


=o



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by Captain P on Fri Nov 11th at 10:06pm 2005

// CP gets the heck out of CSS subjects... <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">



Create-ivity - a game development blog



Quote
 Re: Blasphemous
Posted by satchmo on Sun Nov 13th at 9:55pm 2005

I learned how to hand-tune the nav mesh, and now the bots are pretty darn scary.

It's quite fun tuning the mesh. It's almost like another stage of mapping, but it's an entirely different skill completely. The best analogy is info_nodes and hint_nodes for NPC's, except that the mesh is much more versatile.




"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge




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