Bah, politics!
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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by WarloK on Thu Apr 6th at 2:01am 2006


Nickle and I had a debate on politics, and the justification of Britain being dragged into the Iraq war. So i'd like to take this up in the pit.


What do the rest of you have to say on the matter?
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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Gwil on Thu Apr 6th at 2:08am 2006


I don't see *why* we joined in. This "special relationship" justification just doesn't wash. Ideally there would have been a referendum on it, but hey, what can you do?

As long as we don't do the asshole thing and pull out too early, i'm beyond trying to explain why and how we got into this bloody mess.






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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Juim on Thu Apr 6th at 3:20am 2006


Absolutely agreed Gwil. People all over the globe are always on about Americans now, thanks to George Bush and his more than obvious ties to American Oil and their subsequent agendas, but the American soldiers are there for a bigger purpose, albeit masked behind said agendas. It would be a shame to pull them out before there mission is completed, creating yet another generation of frustrated under-appreciated soldiers.(can you say Vietnam?)



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Andrei on Thu Apr 6th at 8:13am 2006



What I don't get is why countries like Bulgaria and Romania agreed to sending troops in Iraq. I know their contribution isn't exactly generous, but IMO 1 soldier is too many. I can assume it was all part of an ass-kissing strategy.




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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by reaper47 on Thu Apr 6th at 12:22pm 2006


Every 14-year-old kid watching the news could see that the Iraq war was unjustified or at least shortsightedly planned. I don't believe that politicians are that stupid, though. They had a very desperate reason for doing it anyway. Sometimes I think it's more than just oil... but what I don't know.



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Andrei on Thu Apr 6th at 1:13pm 2006


And now there's that Iran crisis. Somehow, knowing that Iran have nuclear weapons makes me feel less uneasy than the fact that an idiot like Bush has nuclear weapons.




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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Orpheus on Thu Apr 6th at 1:17pm 2006


I still have faith enough to believe that "Oil" wasn't the deciding factor. Whenever I look at the gas pump, I waver in that faith but.. I keep thinking "We can grow our own gasoline, why is it still so high?"

As far as why Britain, or any other country joining? Well, the way I see it is this. Even when its a poor choice, if you cannot talk your best friend out of a self destructive mess you join him to see to it that he doesn't do to much damage.

Perhaps Britain joined to keep tabs on the USA and make sure, to the best of their ability, that we do not screw the pooch to badly.

As I said, If they couldn't talk us out of it, then being friends it was their obligation to help keep it as civil as possible.

*shrugs*

Simplistic, but I bet its a fair assessment.





The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Bewbies on Fri Apr 7th at 12:02am 2006


bush's fault.


the players tried to take the field
the marching band refused to yield



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Nickelplate on Fri Apr 7th at 3:51am 2006


I can honestly say that I appreciate the soldiers.

There are people over there that hate all westerners for no real reason and would kill us all if they had the chance. Those soldiers, whether they are Bulgarian, Romanian, UK-ian or USA-ian, are killing those bad people and keeping them from having hatefull little children. It will all turn out for the best, even if it WAS unjustified, good things will happen soon I think.




I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Andrei on Fri Apr 7th at 10:16am 2006


? quote:

There are people over there that hate all westerners for no real reason and would kill us all if they had the chance. Those soldiers, whether they are Bulgarian, Romanian, UK-ian or USA-ian, are killing those bad people and keeping them from having hatefull little children. It will all turn out for the best, even if it WAS unjustified, good things will happen soon I think.



You see, that's the kind of mentality that many americans need to get out of their heads. Do you really think people in the middle-east hate the west and the US because it's in their genetic make-up?





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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by reaper47 on Fri Apr 7th at 5:53pm 2006


? quote:
I can honestly say that I appreciate the soldiers.
There are people over there that hate all westerners for no real reason and would kill us all if they had the chance. Those soldiers, whether they are Bulgarian, Romanian, UK-ian or USA-ian, are killing those bad people and keeping them from having hatefull little children. It will all turn out for the best, even if it WAS unjustified, good things will happen soon I think.


ouch... the question is why do they hate Americans. I'm absolutely sure that all the islamistic propaganda is only the tip of the iceberg, an aftereffect. And going there starting just another war they have no chance of winning "fairly" (-> terrorism) certainly wont improve the relationship. The only solution would be to "kill 'em all"... and we're Germany 1933-1945. History is an ironic bitch.




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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Nickelplate on Fri Apr 7th at 7:07pm 2006


we KNOW why they hate americans. It's because we are like the biggest sinners in the world to them. We have shows ABOUT sins and we have everything we could ever want and we still want more.

Not only that but westerners have been screwing brown people for ages. It's just that everyone else has gotten on with thier lives.

  • We're the great satan (according to THEIR beleifs)
  • We're responsible for the turmoil there, only not really, because BRITAIN is the one that screwed everything up over there a long time ago.
  • We're greedy bass turds
  • They're hateful

It all adds up to form a bad situation.




I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by pepper on Fri Apr 7th at 7:55pm 2006


Britain indeed screwed up big time over there, but you cant quite blame em. I think it was the responsibilty of all of us to act. But we didnt.

Really, its just a group that f**ks it all up for the others there. Most people i've met that came from those country's are really friendly and open. Just as in every culture it are the small minority's that screw it for all of us.




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The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee.



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by FatStrings on Tue Apr 11th at 3:02am 2006


the funny thing is nickel, some of those really are true
for example:

we are greedy ass turds
and at this point we are most of the turmoil over there




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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Forceflow on Tue Apr 11th at 8:37am 2006


I don't think the question is wether or not there is a problem with the people in the Middle-East. Because there isn't. Hell, we've got terrorists in Europe too. ETA, the bloody IRA (sure sure, they cut it down on the shooting stuff, but still ..).

The 'War against terrorism' (hate that word, sounds like a bad, bad Tom Clancy book) should not be fought on a battlefield in Iraq. That's like claiming that Iraq is chock-full of terrorists. (Which it isn't !)



:: Forceflow.be :: Nuclear Dawn developer



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by ReNo on Tue Apr 11th at 12:49pm 2006


Sounds like a premise for a Clancy book, but he'd never use a title quite as bad as that <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif">





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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by rival on Tue Apr 11th at 3:26pm 2006


I have long since stopped trying to argue with any one over this particular issue for two reasons: 1) I don't have a solid opinion on the matter 2) each arguement for and against it cancel each other out, eg. there werent any weapons of mass destruction over there, we shouldn't have gone. Yes we should have because we got rid of a tyrant. See each arguement cancels another out, just too hard to explain why or why not. We should be arguing over what we are going to do now we are over there.




Bullet Control: $5000 for a bullet.
&quot;I would blow your f**king head off! ...if I could afford it. I'm gonna get another job, start saving some money... then you a dead man!&quot;



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by FatStrings on Wed Apr 12th at 3:26am 2006


but iraq must be full of terrorists isn't it part of the axis of evil
rival makes a good point




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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Nickelplate on Wed Apr 12th at 5:41am 2006


"Terrorists" is a word that gets thrown around way too much. Let's stick with "assholes" instead. It makes is seem like SO many more people deserve to die. Which they do... Assholes....

Seriously though, this is going to sound harsh, but I've got two things relating to today's news.

  1. Muslims need to stop hating ppl and get over it. We need to get out of Iraq and start worrying about assholes in N. Korea and Iran, with thier nukes and crap.
  2. Illegal immigrants need to go the f*ck home and stop breaking or laws. We can't support everyone: if people in other countries are dying, let them ask us how to make THEIR country prosperous like ours and don't get all pissed when we tell them what to change. Confucius said: "Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he will eat for a lifetime." So instead of sending money and food one-at-a-time and having them come over here, we go over THERE and we teach them how to get thier own food and how to get thier sh*t together.

Yesterday, someone told me that we ought to let anyone and everyone who wants in into the country without any system and let them just cross the borders and such. Then we ought to raise taxes, stop spending on the defense budget and give those people the extra money the government will have gained. That is BULL---SH*T!




I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com



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Re: Bah, politics!
Posted by Andrei on Wed Apr 12th at 11:32am 2006


I somewhat agree with what you say about immigration, but isn't that a little idealist? There are way too many factors involved. You can't just expect such a large number of people to change overnight. There will always be that "the grass is greener on the other side" mentality. And even if 99,9% of all Mexicans decide to stay home and make their country better, there will always be that 0.1% that will get the rest to say "f**k this, i'm going to the US like [insert catchy mexican name here] did." Viva the herd instinct.

As for Iran and Korea having nukes...I really don't see why Iran and Korea can't have their own nuclear programs when that asshole Bush affords to publicly state that the US is mining and enriching uranium for...secret projects. The US should disarm themselves before going on a crusade to disarm others. But they won't, will they? Why? Because they're afraid of being harassed by other countries that will refuse to disarm the moment they will have buried their missiles? The same thing applies for Korea and Iran. So what do we do? Drop cruisemissiles at everyone we fear or dislike? That indeed sounds like the Bush-way of dealing with things.

I'm such an asshole.





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