Snarkpit Forum Index » General Banter » QQ. A quick question from da_killa
QQ. A quick question from da_killa
« previous page 12
3
...
45 next page »
Post Reply
Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Naklajat on Fri Jan 19th at 12:54pm 2007

Unreal Engine 3 is Unix-compatible, and Epic has stated that a native Linux version of UT2007 will be available to those who purchase the game. There are going to be a lot of games running on UE3, I think it's possible that this plus Vista being bloated trash will create a snowball effect and Linux and Mac could gain a lot of popularity in the coming years.


=o



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by reaper47 on Fri Jan 19th at 1:26pm 2007

Yea, I too hope that an open source OS will become a serious competition someday. Since Firefox I?m far more optimistic with predictions like that. It actually sounds quite logical in long terms.


Why snark works.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Pvt.Scythe on Fri Jan 19th at 1:57pm 2007

I recently managed to get Steam running with Wine under Ubuntu(a Linux distribution), I even played Empires for a while. Many games(and their engines of course) already have a Linux port(Doom III, UT2k3/4, Quake 3, to name some). I hope that a game market will form for Linux users as it would result in better driver support(I guess I've never cursed my ATI Radeon 9800 Pro so much before all those nights spent fighting with the FireGL drivers) and provide an alternative platform for players.

The current problem with Linux and game makers supporting it is probably the lack of standards in the Linux world, almost every installation can be completely different in damn many levels that it will be extremely hard and time consuming to make something work on every distribution. Well one can always wish...



''Everyone wades in s**t until they're competent enough to walk on it. Jesus style.''
Dystopia - Empires



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by reaper47 on Fri Jan 19th at 3:12pm 2007

I'm not a Linux person but I tried a few typical Linux programs and saw it in action here and there and I doubt it's a lack of (technical) features that keeps people from switching. It's really all about usability. It's hard enough to get a Windows PC to work the way you want it to, with Linux everything seems to take longer, there are less standards, useful features hidden behind useless ones ect.

Before Linux becomes a serious gaming (or working) platform there has to come a single version of it that becomes standard. There are so many different kinds of Unix/Linux (I don't even know the difference) with mostly plain awful interfaces that it all takes too much time and you feel like there is no real mass-support, you feel like you're lost.

This article perfectly describes what keeps casual and professional users from using Freeware alternatives. The thing is: A couple of years ago you could have written a similar article about web browsers... <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">


Why snark works.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Crono on Fri Jan 19th at 6:37pm 2007

If you design for the Linux kernel (past some version) and take into consideration what architecture it will be running on ... then there should be no problem. The problems arise when you rely on specific distribution API. But if you don't use those (you don't have to) then there should be no issues distribution to distribution. (There are exceptions, of course)

So, the problem is that there's no uniform API that works on any distribution of Linux. That could be done. I mean, after all it's just a huge library of pre-written functions that do a lot of the mundane work for developers.


Blame it on Microsoft, God does.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by reaper47 on Fri Jan 19th at 9:07pm 2007

I still think it's not so much a programming issue than a screen-design one. Firefox (yes, I. Like. Firefox.) for example has a very, very clean layout and structure. It's so easy to use and I think getting there is way harder and the benefit is way bigger than many Linux Users think. I think the main reason many people (including me) didn't bother installing a version of Linux yet is that the interface is seriously scary and cluttered (not that windows was much better but it took me years to find even the most basic things in windows and I only learned it because I had to).

When I search for Linux desktop in google I find a lot of pictures that all look like this. And not only that, every one of them looks completely different. I think the customizability of Linux desktops has made it look much too difficult to the eyes of casual users. A Linux screenshot for me is a serious turn-off, mostly. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/sad.gif">


Why snark works.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by amanderino on Fri Jan 19th at 11:49pm 2007

The screenshots aren't hard for me to follow. It just seems like someone wanted to show off and opened up some windows just to look fancy. I have a few distributions of Linux, one of them being Ubuntu. I liked it a lot, but I'd have to download a new version of it now. I've heard that Ubuntu 6.10 Edgy Eft was really good.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Crono on Sat Jan 20th at 12:25am 2007

You have to understand something. The desktop interface is independent of the operating system.

So there are HUNDREDS of different interfaces you can use. They all have their own APIs and everything.

If you think it's REALLY hard to use, give Gnome or KDE a shot, I guarantee that you wont get confused.

Here's a shot from the newest KDE.

How daunting does that look? When displaying the interface they need to show you what you can do with it, so opening a bunch of stuff showing the different effects and window styles is normal. It'd be identical if you opened like 20 windows all at once on your Windows machine and showed it to someone who never used it before. It's not particularly complex by any means and is, for the most part, generally customizable.

If you understand how to use an OS GUI like Windows, you'll understand just about every Linux/Unix/Solaris/BSD/OSx GUI. They follow familiar ground so people don't get confused using it.

You can so something very alien on a Windows machine as well, so it's really just your perception because you've never personally used it. If you installed something like ... Fedora Core ... you'd notice that it's running on the Gnome GUI ... but the interface is very useful and very. VERY. simple (Gnome is generally simplistic).

The thing is. On a Linux machine, you have a choice. These aren't different themes or some garbage like that (though most interfaces support themes) they're completely seperate yet operate on the same OS.


Blame it on Microsoft, God does.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Jan 20th at 4:54am 2007

? quoting Tracer Bullet
http://www.iespell.com/

Whenever I am tired, or just down in the dumps I can always count on Snarkpit to make my day. If I dig deep enough.

Thanx Obie.





The best things in life, aren't things.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Le Chief on Sat Jan 20th at 6:09am 2007

Thats nice to hear.


Aaron's Stuff



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by reaper47 on Sat Jan 20th at 2:44pm 2007

I don't say I understand Linux but what I mean is that the huge number of very different looking (be it taskbar location, default program folder structures or just the colors and shape of menus) interfaces does no good to Linux' popularity. It's probably a psychological thing, but I think if there was one, single interface that is accepted by a majority would claim to be the "new standard" and would be advertised as a good alternative to casual users it could win over a lot of people that feel intimidated by the "choice".

I believe many people don't want choice. They want what everybody else has.

I'm not sure if that's good or bad but it's what keeps people to stay with windows. I think if one group of programmers and interface experts decided to build a perfect, smooth, easy-to-use interface and advertise it in the web as the absolute standard (perhaps with a few testers before) kinda like - you guessed it - Firefox, that wouldn't be selfish or something. It could be what Linux needs so badly. A face. Something very recognizable for us stupid people <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif">


Why snark works.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Crono on Sat Jan 20th at 11:42pm 2007

Then they can use KDE. That's what it would default to anyway.

But don't you dare say they should eliminate all the interfaces, that's ridiculous.
Moving the task bar is arbitrary. You can do that in Windows as well.

You'd have a harder time setting the OS up than using whatever interface. The point is, you're making excuses. You wont realize how simple it is until you use it, it's not something you can really judge by screenshots.

There's KDE and Gnome, two interfaces that are included with almost every single distribution of Linux, KDE especially, is more Windows like than you can imagine. Of course you wont try it, so you wont know what I'm talking about. But eliminating choices would do nothing but alienate the people who already use it. And keep in mind, people do use different GUIs, or none at all.


Blame it on Microsoft, God does.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Naklajat on Sun Jan 21st at 1:13am 2007

I think one of the major barriers to veteran Windows users installing Linux for the first time is that a fresh install needs some work before it's really usable. That's not to say fresh install of Windows doesn't, but on Linux the work involves using the shell command line, package dependancies, etc, and that's only if everything is functioning as it should be. I've installed Windows many many times, and only had major problems enough times to count on one hand, whereas I've installed Linux about a dozen and less than half went without a serious hitch. For example, more than once I've installed a Linux distro only to find that X is trying to use a resolution that's not supported by my monitor, so I have to search for the solution with a text-only web browser, assuming my network connection is working.

From my fairly brief time working in tech support, that's more involved than most people ever have been or want to be in their computer. They just want it to work, they don't care how. I don't foresee Linux gaining a big share of the market unless it becomes more accessible to that type of person. Last I checked there was some improvement on that front, but there's still a long way to go.

I'll probably run Linux full-time once UT2007 is released (assuming the editing tools run on Linux).


=o



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Crono on Sun Jan 21st at 2:09am 2007

Fedora Core has a one touch installation feature, as does some SuSE distributions. They'll configure the partitioning as well as the packages that are installed.

Something like Slackware, or Gentoo are not aimed at the individuals you speak of. But people who don't want to think about, but just install, can use many distributions that are actually aimed at them (Fedora Core, Xandros, and Linspire to name a few, two of which actually run Win32 binaries)

There are no excuses, for whatever your need, there is a linux distribution suited for you. If you want to be oblivious to the inner-workings: you can be.


Blame it on Microsoft, God does.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Orpheus on Sun Jan 21st at 2:15am 2007

Just once you guys are gonna talk about something I can relate to like using charcoal instead of gas.

I can relate to charcoal. This crap about Winsock 32 kernel whatchamacallit just sux owl droppings.

Next thing you know you asswipes are gonna be posting in 1's and 0's.





The best things in life, aren't things.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Crono on Sun Jan 21st at 2:18am 2007

None of those things go hand in hand.
And Gas has many advantages. The monotonously "better" flavor is not enough to make it a better alternative for grilling.

And the Kernel is insanely important, even if people think it's silly to discuss. It's the heart of the OS and is responsible for every "expected" ability in an operating system. (Like creating and managing processes and threads as well as managing I/O) If you write a Kernel and a shell (the shell is the easy part), you technically have an OS there. Everything outside of that are details of preference and stem from decisions some developer made.


Blame it on Microsoft, God does.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Orpheus on Sun Jan 21st at 2:43am 2007

Adam, no matter what they said about you in IRC, you still make me laugh.

If Snarkpit ever has a member of the month award, I am gonna nominate you 12 times a year. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/rofl.gif">





The best things in life, aren't things.



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Rumple on Sun Jan 21st at 3:48am 2007

? quoting Orpheus
Next thing you know you asswipes are gonna be posting in 1's and 0's. :P


Code:
010101000110000101101100011010110110100101101110011001110010000001101001011011100010000001101111011011100110010101110011001000000110000101101110011001000010000001111010011001010111001001101111011100110010000001101001011100110010000001100110011101010110111000100001



<A HREF="http://rumple.biz" TARGET="_blank">SourDough2.0</A> - With Strawberry Jam



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by Naklajat on Sun Jan 21st at 3:52am 2007

*Ahem*

Code:
01011001011001010111001100101100001000000101001001110101011011010111000001101100011001010010110000100000011010010111010000100000011010010111001100101110


You asked for it Orph :P


=o



Quote
 Re: QQ. A quick question from da_killa
Posted by FatStrings on Sun Jan 21st at 4:03am 2007

i am a windows user, because of compatibility, but i learned to use photoshop on a mac, and from experience they are much better for design type work

and aaron, you should use firefox just for the sake of spellcheck, i'll bet it just puts a big dotted red line under your whole post




« previous page 12
3
...
45 next page »
Post Reply