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Game Design Degree Programs?
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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Jinx on Sat May 31st at 12:00am 2008

Boo. Been gone a while. Yes, yes I have.

I am considering going back to school- for game design. Obviously I can use "The Google", but it brings up a lot of garbage. I expect at least a few of you are in or considering going to school for this and I thought some of you might have suggestions.

I already have a BA and an MA (English and Anthropology. What was I thinking?). So in some ways a shorter program would be better, I don't need to take a bunch of off-topic classes.

I'm just wondering what kind of degree I will need to get a decent job, if there are any schools to look into or avoid, etc. I'm also interested in learning more 3D design etc. in general (ie special effects etc.)

Thanks in advance. Been gone too long <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


<A HREF=\"http://www.ministryofaction.net\" TARGET=\"_blank\">Action Half-Life</A> - <A HREF=\"http://distraction-mod.com\" TARGET=\"_blank\">Distrac



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by mazemaster on Sat May 31st at 3:17am 2008

Are you mostly interested in the art side of things (levels, models, 2d art)?



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by RedWood on Sat May 31st at 7:34am 2008

first off i'll say i don't know what im talking about...

I hate to say this but i think if you want a job of relevance in the gaming industry that you have to learn most of it on your own and build a portfolio and hope your discovered by a developer.
I think the most important thing is that you have talent.

I could sagest classes but i need to know what you want to do exactly.


Reality has become a commodity.



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Sat May 31st at 7:20pm 2008

I've been told that your portfolio is the most important thing. Lots of people come out of art school / game school with only their school assignments to show for it, which is really unimpressive. You have to keep doing what you've been doing: making maps, making mods, having a strong and unique portfolio. That degree alone won't do you any good.

Anyway, some names I've seen thrown around: Carnegie Mellon, SCAD, Guildhall, Digipen. Full Sail is okay too, I'm told, though be extra wary of programs like Westwood College.



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Finger on Sat May 31st at 10:21pm 2008

Guildhall, FullSail, ArtInstitute's will all give you a fairly solid start-point for getting into the industry. These schools don't guarantee you a career in game design, but they will give you the format for focusing and learning. It's up to you to use it. Here's my best advice, if you are serious about this.

> Figure out what you are most interested in.
- Design? Study game mechanics, what makes things fun, the psychology of leading, teaching, and rewarding people. Play games, analyze them. Also any art or programming experience will help you. I find there are 2 different flavors of designer - artist/designer or programmer/designer. Both have their place in the industry, but It's good to know what category you fall in.

- Art? Study next gen creation techniques, fine arts training is one of the most important things you can have. Study basic composition, color theory, drawing, painting. Figure out whether you want to do 3D or 2D (nowdays almost everyone needs to know basic 3D..even 2D concept artists.) With art, you really need to keep your eye on what's around the corner so you can study and learn the proper techniques that developers are using.

Answering these questions is the hard part. A school is only as good as the effort you put into it. I've seen people hired straight out of schools like Guildhall, FullSail, ArtInstitue. I've also seen tons of people pay $30,000 for this education, then throw it down the drain. It all comes down to you and your focus.

Figure out what you want to specialize in. Master something as quickly as you can, while building a background of general knowledge related to game design. Don't try to be a Jack-Of-All-Trades - it will take you way to long to reach a professional level of craftsmanship if you are spread too thin.

Don't worry about talent.... it is way overrated. If you have a passion for something, work hard, focus, and you WILL get where you want to be.




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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by ReNo on Sat May 31st at 10:56pm 2008

Hey mate, good to see you back <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

I did a game specific degree at uni. Being based in Scotland its obviously not one thats really relevant to yourself, but worth mentioning I guess.

The course I did was BSc Computer Games Technology at the University of Abertay. Not a fabulous uni, but about the first in the UK to offer a game dev related course and so it was (still is?) one of the most established and respected. The course was primarily programming based, which perhaps should have put me off as I didn't harbour intentions of becoming a game programmer. I did intend on becoming a level/game designer though, and I decided it was probably about as close and related a course as I was likely to find.

Glad I did it, for what thats worth. I'm now a (somewhat) competent programmer and feel like a far more all-round game developer. I don't think that the course was everything that it was cracked up to be, and I don't think that if I were going for a programming position it would have made me all that ready for it, but its given me a degree and it made me learn something I otherwise probably wouldn't have, so it served me fairly well.

Game design courses? I'm not so sure. The positions that somebody studying ni one of these courses is likely to be looking to gain - level design, game design, env. artist, character artist, etc... - are really more driven by portfolios. Having a degree in a related topic is a nice bonus, but it won't get you the job over somebody who has a nicer portfolio.

So basically, I don't think that having a game design degree will get you a job. That said, what you learn from that game design degree might enable you to make a portfolio that will. So whether the course is worthwhile or not is really down to whether you think it will let you learn the skills to make a decent portfolio more efficiently than being self-taught.

Anyways, thats my 2 pence worth.

PS. Have a read through this thread at mapcore. Its regarding an article on a game dev site written by a guy who did one of these courses and afterward was unable to get a job. If you then take a look at his portfolio it becomes fairly clear why that is the case. I wouldn't let it put you off the idea of doing the course - seems he's just not very talented or not very motivated to do his own work beyond the course requirements - but its worth reading.



Designer @ Haiku Interactive | ReNo-vation.net



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Le Chief on Sat May 31st at 11:34pm 2008

I agree, a portfolio is probably the most important thing. You should have a really strong portfolio with strong pieces of work.

Also, check out these, there really helpful imo:

.:3D Art:. .:Design:. .:Level Design:.


Aaron's Stuff



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by omegaslayer on Sun Jun 1st at 2:53am 2008

Are you a portal fan? Why not follow what the creator did and go to DigiPen school in Washington. Valve saw Kim's school project called nabacular drop, liked it SO much that they hired her + their team as soon as they graduated. Like wise all game development studios hire these students right when the graduate. I visited the campus myself ~2 years ago, looked at what they had to offer and this was what I came to propose:

There are two areas of study:

Art (3D modeling, texturing, 2D art, level design (kinda) etc.)-
They start you off by building your art skills with paper and pencil, then work from there. They don't teach you how to use Maya right off the bat.... They build your basic skills with key frames, animations, fluid dynamics. Their philosophy is that they build their basic skills before showing you a tool like maya, because lets face it, maya, max, 3d studio whatever MAY be replaced by a new greater tool. And if alls you learned was how to use maya, well your up s**t creek. Digipen makes sure you have your basic artistic tools intact. Its pretty rigorous, to get into this program you must already have an art portfolio with 3 pieces to show, as well as 5 samples that were drawn free hand from observing the natural world around you.

Programming(engine design, Graphic design, networking, etc.)-
They start you by building your basic mathematical skills. Algebra (basic arithmetic for calculating distances, Cartesian points) Calculus (3D spacial coordinates), and finite mathematics (basic boolean algebra). They they work up your programming skills. In general they teach you C++ (and a bit of C) because of its ease, speed, and memory manipulation. They teach you how to use the direct X library's, then go a little into how to code your own mod in source. They build basics again here, they tell you how to code your own engine, so your not restricted to using someone elses (aka: source).

You can take these degrees further than game design as well. You can take your Art degree and go into graphic design or even movie graphics. You can take your programming degree and apply to M$. When I went there there was a M$ person who did their hiring, he said that he had just hired a VERY qualified candidate from their school for a networking programmer.

In general this school is like the harvard of game design. I would have gone if it weren't for the cost. In general you take a unit load of 18 units a semester at the beginning, then slow down to 15 per semester. That leaves no time for a job (they recommend that students work no more than 20 hours a week). If $ isn't an issue for you jinx, I HIGHLY recommend this place, at the very least check it out.

As another note: every year there was an igf (independent games festival) at the GDC, the student project of the year wins a lot of awards.


Posting And You



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Naklajat on Sun Jun 1st at 7:56am 2008

I'd suggest looking into schools and programs in cities that have a lot of game industry studios (check out http://www.gamedevmap.com/) since you're much more likely to get a quality education. I'd also recommend making sites like gamasutra a part of your regular reading.

As I'm not in the industry (yet!) this is mostly second hand from speaking with the instructors in the course I'm taking, most of which are current employees at major studios.

A degree is nice to have, but by no means necessary, any degree is about as good as a game-specific degree. It basically just proves that you have the determination to complete something over the course of years. What's most important is having the portfolio and personality to show potential employers you'd be someone good to have at their company when you go for interviews. Having a degree will help you get those interviews.

As for me...
I'm taking a certificate program at Austin Community College, 13 42-hour classes and a final group project, a game demo/prototype. Among my instructors have been a Lead Designer from Bioware, a Senior Artist from NCSoft, a former art director at Origin (who just got hired as project manager for a new game at Sony), and one of the managers/founders of a few things like Kesmai and GEnie, who's been active on the business side of online games since around the time the internet and video games met.

I've gained a lot of very useful knowledge from this program that I know will help me down the road when I'm applying for jobs, and I've only completed 5 of 13 classes.

That said, most of my progress and development as an artist has been down to my own research and effort. As others have mentioned you can go to school and come out with a degree in game ______ and still not be prepared to do that for a living. I've found that drawing and sketching make me a better 3D artist and vice versa. They're both the exact same in the critical aspect that the only way to get better is to create (crummy) art ad nauseum, and there's not really any shortcut for that. If you want to be an artist the very best thing you can do is to flex your art muscles hard and often. Push your limits and they will move.


=o



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Jinx on Mon Jun 2nd at 11:57am 2008

Thanks guys, this helps a lot. I will check out the links as well.

I actually have... two degrees. Just in mostly unrelated fields, English (BA) and Cultural Anthropology (MA). While I was totally miserable in the ma/phd program, I spent more time mapping than working on grad school :x I know it seems nuts to change your life's focus after all that other school work, but I don't want to keep going in the wrong direction. It's not that I don't like the things I studied, but I had no real passion for them. I was *good* at them, and therefore I felt *obligated* to go into those fields. It wasn't a decision I made for the right reasons.

It is good to know that the portfolio is what is important. I kind of loath the idea of doing another 4 year degree, even though a lot of the general stuff would transfer from my BA. I'm good at learning on my own or with internet resources or from friends like here, so I can focus on that as one part. I'll probably rejoin a mod team to get more experience and build a portfolio with more current work than Half Life 1 (ugh).

Near where my parents live is a small college with a 6-quarter Associates Degree in Game Design. It's nothing spectacular, but it would give me an introduction to programming, design, Maya, etc. at least. So I might consider that to give me a foundation and a basic degree in the field:
http://www.hocking.edu/academics/schools/new_college/digital_game_design_and_development/

I am *not* an artist in terms of being able to draw etc., though I've never tried much either :x Part of why I like using mapping programs, photoshop, etc. is that they let me use my creativity in visual ways that I might not otherwise be able. And I love the technical aspects of it, working with other people on projects, getting feedback, and sharing my work with other people. So I am probably more interested in mapping, modeling, and possibly some broader level design work (narrative, imagery, etc. since I am a writer). I am interested in programming, but in some ways I would rather learn that on my own and avoid taking high level math classes that will make me tear my hair out lol. I'm good at math, I just dislike it when it is too abstract and has no visible use. Logic is fun, though.

Thanks again, let me know if you have any other ideas image


<A HREF=\"http://www.ministryofaction.net\" TARGET=\"_blank\">Action Half-Life</A> - <A HREF=\"http://distraction-mod.com\" TARGET=\"_blank\">Distrac



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by mazemaster on Tue Jun 3rd at 1:45am 2008

Before you drop a lot of money and time on a program, investigate to find out how effective the program is at placing graduates in industry jobs. There are a lot of questionable "game design" programs out there. I'm not saying this one is or isn't - just be wary.



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 Re: Game Design Degree Programs?
Posted by Naklajat on Tue Jun 3rd at 4:11am 2008

It sounds to me like the broadly-termed position of "designer" would be a good fit for your personality and talents. Brainstorming, coming up with gameplay systems, documenting features to be implemented, writing design docs, and designing the gameplay aspect of levels where the artists will come in and hose down with eye candy.


=o




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