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Half-Life 2 so different
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 Re: Half-Life 2 so different
Posted by Gwil on Mon Oct 6th at 12:17pm 2008

Quoting Flynn
Quoting Gwil
you're saying you prefer aldi baked beans to heinz even though heinz is more expensive and better branded smiley

I don't like the HD pack, I don't like how it looks, I don't use it (or rather didn't use it).

Less detailed, dont care.
Less realistic, dont care.
"less pleasing to use" - opinion. I prefer the vanilla models, I find them infinitely more pleasing to use - particularly the rough and satisfying rattle of the MP5.


That is simply a version of brand snobbery you have described there. The soldiers arms look so weird on the normal Half-Life models they looked all disjointed and such. You have listed one thing you prefer from Half-Life original out of loads of things that are better about Half-Life H.D. You really need to lose the "Whatever" attitude you are displaying here. Why would you like the Vanilla shotgun more than the High Definition shotgun? Why would you like the normal soldiers more than the High Definition soldiers?

Quoting haymaker
I installed this pack when blueshift came out; I remember I liked the zombies and not much else, I can't tell you why. Barney looked like a bit of a slob too I think


What do you mean by "Barney looked like a bit of a slob"? Was that with H.D. pack or without? Please explain your reasons for either. You should appreciate the huge attention to detail that went on with the H.D. pack. The body armour of the soldiers looked padded rather than being part of the model skin. You could see the lights flash on their radios for christ's sake!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


It's not! I am saying this:

I prefer the vanilla models. I do not like the HD pack.
You prefer the HD pack. You do not like (as much) the vanilla models.

There is no point trying to say "WHY WOULD YOU PREFER THE VANILLA SHOTGUN MODEL OMG?!?!?!" because that's exactly the same question as "WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU LIKE THE HD PACK, IT IS ASS!?"

I don't like the HD pack, more detailed, more work put into it whatever. I. Do. Not. Like. It.

Eg: I support West Bromwich Albion. By your logic, because Manchester United have invested more money and time into training their players and developing a squad, and therefore their football looks better, I should logically support them. Nonsense.

West Bromwich Albion are the also rans of the Premier League this season i'd wager, and we don't have the flashest forwards or best looking/capacity stadium but I am still going to support them. I don't need to explain my reasons, I just like them over the flashier outfit.

And, as we're into "EXPLAIN YOUR PERSONAL TASTE!" territory, i'd like to point out not only do I like the vanilla models for the nostalgia and familiarity, aesthetics and feel, I also plain old *DO NOT LIKE* the HD pack.





[ Edited by Gwil on Mon Oct 6th 2008 at 12:21pm - total edits: 2]




Quote
 Re: Half-Life 2 so different
Posted by Flynn on Mon Oct 6th at 12:28pm 2008

Quoting aaron_da_killa
To me, the vanilla models have a sentimental value. If you mess with anything from that good old experience, it just isn't the same, that nostalgic value has gone totally.

As for the models themselves, yeah sure there more detailed, I appreciate the detail that has gone into them and all and the effort and such. But just because there is more polygons on screen, doesn't make them great regardless. I don't like the design of some of the weapons and some of the characters there either just too "generic" or just not quite right. That said, I'm not particularly a fan of some of the vanilla Half-life models but I think that generally they seem to be more thought out.


Well aaron. Aren't you the diplomat smiley Me and Gwil are battling over the very essence of the High Definition pack while you are trying to keep it calm all in your corner. I appreciate that.

Half-Life had a huge sentimental value for me. Needless to say, I started it in 2002 with Blue-Shift at which time the H.D. pack was already released. Then in the summer of that same year I got the generation pack (this might be country specific so you might not know what it is).

I notice you again aren't going into specifics like other people. Maybe you lot think it is something that needs to be felt rather than described. Or maybe you are just trying not to drag me off topic even further smiley

It is hard to get back at you without specifics. I would need to know what those weapons and characters were that you didn't like/felt too generic. Either way, I would rather have the original non H.D. pack H-L:1 weapons over the boring set of weapons they have in Half-Life 2 (I managed to sneak that on topic bit in there somewhere).

I am surprised you say you think that the Half-Life non H.D. pack models are more thought out. I mean, a grenade launcher on an M.P.-5? Come again? Trying to think of some other examples...frail old men for security guards ala non H.D. pack Barney. The soldiers arms look disjointed as I mentioned previously. Model textures are all low resolution. I can understand what you say about the good old feel though. The difference is that my good old feel has the H.D. pack incorperated into it.

Quoting Gwil
It's not! I am saying this:

I prefer the vanilla models. I do not like the HD pack.
You prefer the HD pack. You do not like (as much) the vanilla models.

There is no point trying to say "WHY WOULD YOU PREFER THE VANILLA SHOTGUN MODEL OMG?!?!?!" because that's exactly the same question as "WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU LIKE THE HD PACK, IT IS ASS!?"

I don't like the HD pack, more detailed, more work put into it whatever. I. Do. Not. Like. It.

Eg: I support West Bromwich Albion. By your logic, because Manchester United have invested more money and time into training their players and developing a squad, and therefore their football looks better, I should logically support them. Nonsense.

West Bromwich Albion are the also rans of the Premier League this season i'd wager, and we don't have the flashest forwards or best looking/capacity stadium but I am still going to support them. I don't need to explain my reasons, I just like them over the flashier outfit.

And, as we're into "EXPLAIN YOUR PERSONAL TASTE!" territory, i'd like to point out not only do I like the vanilla models for the nostalgia and familiarity, aesthetics and feel, I also plain old *DO NOT LIKE* the HD pack.





Shame. Some people ay smiley You should atleast appreciate the huge attention to detail that went on in there.
smiley smiley

[ Edited by flynn on Mon Oct 6th 2008 at 12:36pm - total edits: 3]



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Quote
 Re: Half-Life 2 so different
Posted by Captain P on Mon Oct 6th at 11:36pm 2008

Odd... I played HL before the expansion packs but ever since I got hold of the HD pack, I've never played HL without it anymore. The HD pack fleshes out the models much more and although moving from a MP5 to an assault rifle was perhaps not the best thing they could do, it made the grunts look all the more heavy. I liked the new sounds, too. smiley

Ah well, to each his own. smiley



Quote
 Re: Half-Life 2 so different
Posted by Yak_Fighter on Tue Oct 7th at 4:06am 2008

another thread successfully derailed *flex*

just think about the HD pack like this: You've just drawn a picture that you love. It's not a masterpiece by any stretch of the imagination, but you love it just the same. Now somebody sees this drawing and decides to arbitrarily change aspects of it to fit their own personal vision, in the process it loses some of its charm. Yeah it might have more detail and better line work or whatever, but it just isn't the original and detracts from it.

Plus the original models fit better with the rest of the original textures and level design. High-res and higher poly stuff doesn't look right when the textures or the level design haven't been made more detailed and complex.



Quote
 Re: Half-Life 2 so different
Posted by Flynn on Tue Oct 7th at 6:30pm 2008

Quoting Captain P
Odd... I played HL before the expansion packs but ever since I got hold of the HD pack, I've never played HL without it anymore. The HD pack fleshes out the models much more and although moving from a MP5 to an assault rifle was perhaps not the best thing they could do, it made the grunts look all the more heavy. I liked the new sounds, too. smiley

Ah well, to each his own. smiley


Yes Captain P, that is what I thought when I came across all this animosity towards the High Definition pack. I guess it was so good looking that I didn't even give a second thought towards people disliking it.

Why do you say that moving from an M.P.-5 to an assault rifle was not the best idea though? I know I liked the sound of the M.P.-5 more. I also thought an assault rifle model should have been reserved for something more powerful.

I have been saying for the last few posts how the High Definition pack fleshes out the models. No one seems to mind the original models though. They are okay but after the H.D. pack I couldn't go back. The soldiers look awesome with the H.D. pack with their chunky weapons and typical "tough guy" faces. Without it they just look plain weird to my eyes. The same with the Barney security guards as well.

I agree about the sounds, they were spot on as well as virtually the whole pack itself.

Quoting Yak_Fighter
another thread successfully derailed *flex*

just think about the HD pack like this: You've just drawn a picture that you love. It's not a masterpiece by any stretch of the imagination, but you love it just the same. Now somebody sees this drawing and decides to arbitrarily change aspects of it to fit their own personal vision, in the process it loses some of its charm. Yeah it might have more detail and better line work or whatever, but it just isn't the original and detracts from it.

Plus the original models fit better with the rest of the original textures and level design. High-res and higher poly stuff doesn't look right when the textures or the level design haven't been made more detailed and complex.


Okay that is a good way to describe it. I thought the Half-Life level design was extremely complex. Mind you that is coming from someone who played Tomb Raider before. I might understand if you had worked on the original Half-Life, but such a heart felt reaction seems strange coming from fans.

I like the high poly stuff. It is interesting that you have said that actually about the less detailed textures. People nowadays have such high resolutions available to them that if they set a high resolution they wouldn't notice the low detailed textures.

Time to sneak something in which is on topic. The weapons on Half-Life 1 were fiddled with by Gordon while you weren't shooting them. This was with and without the H.D. pack. The cylinder of the Mangum actually revolved when fired! Gordon Freeman actually got an R.P.G. in his hand and put it into the front of the launcher. Where is that attention to detail on H.L.-2? The absence of such detail on H.L.-2 makes the weapons a whole lot more unsatifying and unconvincing to use.

[ Edited by flynn on Tue Oct 7th 2008 at 6:35pm - total edits: 1]



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