[SIDE NOTE]: I would have replied earlier, but haven't had much time to work on the map. I will hopefully have something to show by next week.
In the meantime. I've read the past couple of comments on new alterations and am a bit confused. I will try to make a revised diagram based on you guy's description, but I must admit, I'm having a little trouble understanding. Perhaps you can grab the PSD files I posted or make a simple diagram in paint (with levels represented as boxes and whatnot...) to help explain yourselves.
Thanks for the feedback...until next time!
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Thu Oct 23rd at 5:37am 2008
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Posted by Riven on Thu Oct 23rd at 5:37am 2008
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by hlife_hotdog on Thu Oct 23rd at 5:40am 2008
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Posted by hlife_hotdog on Thu Oct 23rd at 5:40am 2008
Okay, this is my layout brainstorm...
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by haymaker on Mon Oct 27th at 4:34am 2008
Posted by haymaker on Mon Oct 27th at 4:34am 2008
Thats not bad Hotdog. My previous comments were all gameplay-based even though that is not the real point of this compilation. So really there are dozens of workable arrangements, more if you work in a z-axis component.
I made a small tram stop in some idle time, would fit your south location perfectly. What about this "new map"? You have something on the go?
I made a small tram stop in some idle time, would fit your south location perfectly. What about this "new map"? You have something on the go?
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by hlife_hotdog on Mon Oct 27th at 7:17am 2008
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Posted by hlife_hotdog on Mon Oct 27th at 7:17am 2008
Well, sort of. It's just that there are so many intersections at that point that a map to connect them seems more feasible (and easier). tell u what, I will make an industrial out-door map to fill that gap and connect to all 4 points if we use a design similar to this it will look right (but doesn't have to be those maps) it will have 4 points, so we can use it like a central hub or something
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Fri Oct 31st at 4:48am 2008
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Posted by Riven on Fri Oct 31st at 4:48am 2008
Alrighty then; Ive been doing some work on the map, but sadly, I don't have any notable in-game screenshots to show you guys. But I did do a sketch today based on haymaker's revision description. Here's what he had to say:
And here is the sketch I drew: (don't mind the pictures on the right side nor the misspelling of diagonal.)
Good luck reading my handwriting!
Quoting haymaker
Ah there we go thank you Riven.
Sample C looks like a pretty good start. They all work aesthetically too. I had wondered about putting Natus' off of the train station as they both could be the same building but it doesn't matter really.
Gameplay isn't really the focus here but it kinda looks like a CS layout, for sure you will be dead in the machine room or the hotdog-tunnel, it may be that one team will never see the other team's start. That is just conjecture really seeing as there's been no design for item placement. Maybe it's not bending the rules to move a few items around, eg there needs to be a big prize in the machinery room. With a little thought to power bases the whole thing could play out better.
If you rotated Natus 90 deg ccw the high exit could connect to the station entrance while the low one could connect to Riven, with a little T-intesection in that passage to a train platform.
If you rotated Redwood 90deg ccw you could connect the "door" exit to the other station entrance ( which is @ SE corner of the block in the pic atm, could be moved ) instead of to a train platform. Doing that would allow you to move Hotdog 2 to the west and shorten that tunnel to hotdog1 there.
The deleted train stop could be moved anywhere SW of hotdog2 with access in the hotdog1 to hotdog2 tunnel, making the circuit more even in terms of time on the train. ( I cant get Pshop to do what I want atm , a pic would be better I know )
Then again the original has its strong points too, making the train a little more useful. I was mainly concerned with relieving choke point pressure a bit, so all my comments are gameplay-based.
Two other perhaps redundant points, I don't see much for visblocking between maps, easy to address; and the train requires a ridiculous amount of room for a 90 deg turn, it's a wedge-shaped box with a selection footprint of 1200 by 1200 ( otherwise the train passes into the tunnel walls ).
Nice work so far everybody.
Sample C looks like a pretty good start. They all work aesthetically too. I had wondered about putting Natus' off of the train station as they both could be the same building but it doesn't matter really.
Gameplay isn't really the focus here but it kinda looks like a CS layout, for sure you will be dead in the machine room or the hotdog-tunnel, it may be that one team will never see the other team's start. That is just conjecture really seeing as there's been no design for item placement. Maybe it's not bending the rules to move a few items around, eg there needs to be a big prize in the machinery room. With a little thought to power bases the whole thing could play out better.
If you rotated Natus 90 deg ccw the high exit could connect to the station entrance while the low one could connect to Riven, with a little T-intesection in that passage to a train platform.
If you rotated Redwood 90deg ccw you could connect the "door" exit to the other station entrance ( which is @ SE corner of the block in the pic atm, could be moved ) instead of to a train platform. Doing that would allow you to move Hotdog 2 to the west and shorten that tunnel to hotdog1 there.
The deleted train stop could be moved anywhere SW of hotdog2 with access in the hotdog1 to hotdog2 tunnel, making the circuit more even in terms of time on the train. ( I cant get Pshop to do what I want atm , a pic would be better I know )
Then again the original has its strong points too, making the train a little more useful. I was mainly concerned with relieving choke point pressure a bit, so all my comments are gameplay-based.
Two other perhaps redundant points, I don't see much for visblocking between maps, easy to address; and the train requires a ridiculous amount of room for a 90 deg turn, it's a wedge-shaped box with a selection footprint of 1200 by 1200 ( otherwise the train passes into the tunnel walls ).
Nice work so far everybody.
And here is the sketch I drew: (don't mind the pictures on the right side nor the misspelling of diagonal.)
Good luck reading my handwriting!
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by haymaker on Wed Nov 12th at 5:55am 2008
Posted by haymaker on Wed Nov 12th at 5:55am 2008
That all looks quite viable Riven. Nothing major I can point out although the appearance of the word "subvertus" had me a little creeped out ( idk what it meant ).
I like the ideas you have around the bottom left there.
I like the ideas you have around the bottom left there.
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Wed Nov 12th at 11:21pm 2008
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Posted by Riven on Wed Nov 12th at 11:21pm 2008
'Subvertus' is an unreleased HL2 SP mod. You can find out more about it here And that was a little note to remind me to bookmark it. -I like to keep track of the mods.
Anyhow, Here's the progress report: I haven't had time these past two weeks to do too much work on the compilation map itself. I've drawn a few more sketches for myself to help me envision what I think some of the hallways could look like but that's it. I just got through with my last final for the quarter and got my fix of L4D since the 6th... (will probably play a little later tonight actually :P). But, for the next two weeks I will have ample amount of time to put into this map, so you guys will probably start seeing every-other daily updates if not daily for the following weeks. My goal is to get it into Beta within 2 weeks or less! So hopefully you guys (and anyone else that wants to comment) will be around to playtest and give feedback during that time.
Thanks for your patience!
Anyhow, Here's the progress report: I haven't had time these past two weeks to do too much work on the compilation map itself. I've drawn a few more sketches for myself to help me envision what I think some of the hallways could look like but that's it. I just got through with my last final for the quarter and got my fix of L4D since the 6th... (will probably play a little later tonight actually :P). But, for the next two weeks I will have ample amount of time to put into this map, so you guys will probably start seeing every-other daily updates if not daily for the following weeks. My goal is to get it into Beta within 2 weeks or less! So hopefully you guys (and anyone else that wants to comment) will be around to playtest and give feedback during that time.
Thanks for your patience!
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Zein on Sun Nov 16th at 11:03pm 2008
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Posted by Zein on Sun Nov 16th at 11:03pm 2008
This is my map, its a small little arena type cave place. Made so the area will make close quarter fights tricky, in the center there is a rocket launcher, to make thigns even more tricky
EDIT
actually maybe you can put this as a sorta secret area, like a door off of the tracks for the train. just an idea.
EDIT
actually maybe you can put this as a sorta secret area, like a door off of the tracks for the train. just an idea.
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Zein on Mon Nov 24th at 5:34am 2008
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Posted by Zein on Mon Nov 24th at 5:34am 2008
So how is it going Riven? No feed back for a while 
hope everything is going good. NEED MORUH FEED BACKZ lol
hope everything is going good. NEED MORUH FEED BACKZ lolZein
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Mon Nov 24th at 6:35am 2008
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Posted by Riven on Mon Nov 24th at 6:35am 2008
Well, I've been working on the map a bit lately. Pretty much all just optimization to get it to playable FPS. I haven't really gotten all the media together to show for the map, but I'll be releasing an alpha soon. The train and haymaker's maps have yet to be implemented, but you won't believe how crappy the map ran before I got to it. I'd like it to run much better as a whole before adding more to it. What was once 40 FPS in some areas, I've been able to bring about to 70+ FPS now, and I didn't move anything. This has been accomplished through clever hint brushwork and func_areaportalwindows. You won't be able to tell the maps have been optimized (except by the FPS readout). The alpha isn't quite ready just yet; i've been keeping a log of changes I am making to the map and that's all I can say for now, screenshots and download will come later in the week.
---UPDATES---
>>Successful Changes:
-All areas have been imported and connected successfully without damage to entity origins and most overlays and decals (any that I can see). Some Brushes had to get cut-up in order to form much better 'render clusters' as I like to call them.
-Areaportalwindows have been added to the entrances and exits of each level.
-Rad has successfully compiled, producing the original lighting (fixed some problems with lights not updating rotation when entire entries were rotated).
-Added appropriate on-grid connecting hallways (still coated in dev-textures and no detail within them yet)
-Brought average FPS of map from 50 to 60. With lowest ares I've recorded at 15-20 FPS, now the lowest area I've come across was at 30 FPS.
>>WIP Changes:
-Aaron's map has SOO many static props, that I will be needing to add entire areaportalwindows just to cut off certain rooms (inside the skinny building) -so that they don't render when you're not in them. Hint brushes simply aren't enough here. Working on fade distances too. Fixed up func_details that were simply too large to help framerate. Simplified underlying bsp brushwork to accommodate Vis a little better. But like I said there will need to be more work done on it to bring it up to speeds with the rest of the maps.
-For my own map, I have A LOT of brush-based entities with virtually no bsp brushes inside the map to break it up, so I've had to start work on converting certain brushes into bsp to form hallways and windows to cut out outside objects you may not need to see, Something not necessary as a single player level, but much more costly as a DM level -this is still very much a WIP, but at least it runs better than the average FPS of the whole compilation map :P
-Still working on player clip brushes and func_illusionary to keep from getting caught up on 'sticky' geometry. Namely, aaron's map and hlife_hotdog's 'valve studio map' but also across the entire compilation map as a whole.
-Adding hint brushes to help break up a lot of obvious non cut-up spaces that could possibly help FPS. Some of which are in RedWood's map and in hlife_hotdog's map.
>>Changes and goals to be met for Alpha 1 release:
-Add in Zein's map comfortably and bring up to or beyond average FPS.
-Raise average FPS of map to 70
-Make player clipping manageable.
-Fix conflicting sounds and add appropriate soundscapes to relevant areas.
-Rearrange player spawns and unify team spawns
-Keep map under 20Mgb (currently 7Mgb -without Rad)
>>Goals for future Beta release:
-Add in train maps and support for train.
-Detail connecting hallways
-Fix and unify weapon spawns (in relation to player spawns)
--Conclusion--
Well, the map has come a long way in my eyes. May not look like it when you guys get your hands on the Alpha. But don't take for granted how it runs. That was NOT a given, and that's what I'm spending most of my time on now. I would have to say (and I think a lot of folks would agree with me) Optimization is probably the most boring part about mapping, but in such cases like this, it HAS to be done, otherwise this map would be unplayable on most servers! It's obviously not moving along as fast as I had hoped, but with patience at my side, I've been able to sit down day-to-day adding in an hour or two of mapping. It's not much, but the hours add up, and I suspect we'll have this out before christmas. Or at least by New Years.
Thanks for the support, and I'll be updating next time with screenshots for sure!
---UPDATES---
>>Successful Changes:
-All areas have been imported and connected successfully without damage to entity origins and most overlays and decals (any that I can see). Some Brushes had to get cut-up in order to form much better 'render clusters' as I like to call them.
-Areaportalwindows have been added to the entrances and exits of each level.
-Rad has successfully compiled, producing the original lighting (fixed some problems with lights not updating rotation when entire entries were rotated).
-Added appropriate on-grid connecting hallways (still coated in dev-textures and no detail within them yet)
-Brought average FPS of map from 50 to 60. With lowest ares I've recorded at 15-20 FPS, now the lowest area I've come across was at 30 FPS.
>>WIP Changes:
-Aaron's map has SOO many static props, that I will be needing to add entire areaportalwindows just to cut off certain rooms (inside the skinny building) -so that they don't render when you're not in them. Hint brushes simply aren't enough here. Working on fade distances too. Fixed up func_details that were simply too large to help framerate. Simplified underlying bsp brushwork to accommodate Vis a little better. But like I said there will need to be more work done on it to bring it up to speeds with the rest of the maps.
-For my own map, I have A LOT of brush-based entities with virtually no bsp brushes inside the map to break it up, so I've had to start work on converting certain brushes into bsp to form hallways and windows to cut out outside objects you may not need to see, Something not necessary as a single player level, but much more costly as a DM level -this is still very much a WIP, but at least it runs better than the average FPS of the whole compilation map :P
-Still working on player clip brushes and func_illusionary to keep from getting caught up on 'sticky' geometry. Namely, aaron's map and hlife_hotdog's 'valve studio map' but also across the entire compilation map as a whole.
-Adding hint brushes to help break up a lot of obvious non cut-up spaces that could possibly help FPS. Some of which are in RedWood's map and in hlife_hotdog's map.
>>Changes and goals to be met for Alpha 1 release:
-Add in Zein's map comfortably and bring up to or beyond average FPS.
-Raise average FPS of map to 70
-Make player clipping manageable.
-Fix conflicting sounds and add appropriate soundscapes to relevant areas.
-Rearrange player spawns and unify team spawns
-Keep map under 20Mgb (currently 7Mgb -without Rad)
>>Goals for future Beta release:
-Add in train maps and support for train.
-Detail connecting hallways
-Fix and unify weapon spawns (in relation to player spawns)
--Conclusion--
Well, the map has come a long way in my eyes. May not look like it when you guys get your hands on the Alpha. But don't take for granted how it runs. That was NOT a given, and that's what I'm spending most of my time on now. I would have to say (and I think a lot of folks would agree with me) Optimization is probably the most boring part about mapping, but in such cases like this, it HAS to be done, otherwise this map would be unplayable on most servers! It's obviously not moving along as fast as I had hoped, but with patience at my side, I've been able to sit down day-to-day adding in an hour or two of mapping. It's not much, but the hours add up, and I suspect we'll have this out before christmas. Or at least by New Years.
Thanks for the support, and I'll be updating next time with screenshots for sure!
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Le Chief on Mon Nov 24th at 7:39am 2008
Posted by Le Chief on Mon Nov 24th at 7:39am 2008
Awesome! I can't wait to see what your cooking up, I know its going to be awesome, I have seen your other work 
.
Do you have any screenshots or is it still a secret :dodgy:?
If you need any help, give us a yell, I'd love to help ya out
.
.
Do you have any screenshots or is it still a secret :dodgy:?
If you need any help, give us a yell, I'd love to help ya out
.
Quoting Riven
Aaron's map has SOO many static props...
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Tue Nov 25th at 4:55am 2008
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Posted by Riven on Tue Nov 25th at 4:55am 2008
Well, as promised here are some screenshots of the overview of the map. Note however, the paths connecting each level may not be so strait-forward, BUT the distances involved amongst the levels are permanent (unless it NEEDS to be changed for whatever reason).
I didn't take any in-game screenshots of the different parts of levels because they look the same, nothing is supposed to change about them anyway, so if you want to see them, just load up the first page of this thread with the screenshots already taken.
Here's the current overview:
Note how My map is not rotated, and because of which, the corridors leading to the exits are fairly long, this is because of a lot of the entities, when rotated lost their original angles and were spinning and moving in the wrong directions, Instead of hassling with this (easily a couple of days' work) I left it at its original angle to prevent from all the moving parts from messing-up; Hopefully this won't be too cumbersome on the gameplay, but we'll see.
Here's a shot of some of the new hint brushes I've applied to aaron's entry:
So as you can see, there is more under the pie crust than you can taste.
-And that's all I have for now! Ask me any questions you may have because the download should be coming soon too!
I didn't take any in-game screenshots of the different parts of levels because they look the same, nothing is supposed to change about them anyway, so if you want to see them, just load up the first page of this thread with the screenshots already taken.
Here's the current overview:
Note how My map is not rotated, and because of which, the corridors leading to the exits are fairly long, this is because of a lot of the entities, when rotated lost their original angles and were spinning and moving in the wrong directions, Instead of hassling with this (easily a couple of days' work) I left it at its original angle to prevent from all the moving parts from messing-up; Hopefully this won't be too cumbersome on the gameplay, but we'll see.
Here's a shot of some of the new hint brushes I've applied to aaron's entry:
So as you can see, there is more under the pie crust than you can taste.
-And that's all I have for now! Ask me any questions you may have because the download should be coming soon too!
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by haymaker on Tue Nov 25th at 7:09am 2008
Posted by haymaker on Tue Nov 25th at 7:09am 2008
Nice work Riven, I can only imagine the amount of work going into this. I can't finish my own maps let alone a pile of everyone else's!
Too bad those corridors have to be so long, but c'est la vie in this case I suppose. What's your VVis time so far?
Too bad those corridors have to be so long, but c'est la vie in this case I suppose. What's your VVis time so far?
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Wed Nov 26th at 6:53pm 2008
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Posted by Riven on Wed Nov 26th at 6:53pm 2008
Vvis actually runs pretty fast. When I go to compile with everything on normal, the entire compile process takes exactly 15 minutes. Vvis alone on normal takes about 1-3 minutes. So, It's gotten to the point where I can watch an episode of Southpark online while it compiles. I'm compiling with an Intel Core2 Duo (T7700) @ 2.40GHz with 2 GB of RAM on Vista. I expect everything to double when I add-in the train parts. But when I compile for optimization testing, I don't run Vrad, and sometimes, I'll run Vvis on fast just to see if the areaportals work. -And those compiles are usually 5 minutes or less.
Also, I've decided to take a sample of hlife_hotdog's diagram and instead of having the train loop around the level, (like I have it in the other diagrams) it will only go back and forth between two endpoints. It makes more sense I think, plus saves the file size! There will still be three stations though (one in the middle). Also, I plan to fit Zein's map as part of an exit from one of the train stations. Because you can only move in one direction, (that is, you drop down from the top and can't climb back up, so you have to leave through the only exit). I'll try to finish up the goals I have for Alpha 1 tonight and get it out tomorrow probably
Also, I've decided to take a sample of hlife_hotdog's diagram and instead of having the train loop around the level, (like I have it in the other diagrams) it will only go back and forth between two endpoints. It makes more sense I think, plus saves the file size! There will still be three stations though (one in the middle). Also, I plan to fit Zein's map as part of an exit from one of the train stations. Because you can only move in one direction, (that is, you drop down from the top and can't climb back up, so you have to leave through the only exit). I'll try to finish up the goals I have for Alpha 1 tonight and get it out tomorrow probably
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Le Chief on Thu Nov 27th at 9:26am 2008
Posted by Le Chief on Thu Nov 27th at 9:26am 2008
Man, glad to see this is getting some momentum!
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Sat Nov 29th at 10:53pm 2008
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Posted by Riven on Sat Nov 29th at 10:53pm 2008
At last, the first alpha is complete you may download it right here: spcm2_alpha1.
Be sure to read the readme, and keep in mind I would like to see some recorded demos of your first playthoughs! They help out more than you think! You can send any demos via any of the contact links listed in the readme, or just post them here in this thread. Anyone is welcome to download this map and check it out!
-The original post to this thread has been updated with a link as well.
Enjoy!
-Riven
Be sure to read the readme, and keep in mind I would like to see some recorded demos of your first playthoughs! They help out more than you think! You can send any demos via any of the contact links listed in the readme, or just post them here in this thread. Anyone is welcome to download this map and check it out!
-The original post to this thread has been updated with a link as well.
Enjoy!
-Riven
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Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by haymaker on Sat Nov 29th at 11:18pm 2008
Posted by haymaker on Sat Nov 29th at 11:18pm 2008
Woohoo! Way to go Riven, three cheers for reaching a milestone. Will check it out tonight!
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Le Chief on Tue Dec 2nd at 11:01am 2008
Posted by Le Chief on Tue Dec 2nd at 11:01am 2008
Alrighty, here is the demo.
Here are some of my thoughts:
- Damn those hallways are boring, I really hope they are made shorter, less linear and way more interesting. I really hope we implement some crazy ideas such as the underwater idea or outer space etc for those hallways.
- Riven's map really slows down the gameplay, not that this is particularly a bad thing, but I wonder how it would play out with alot of players, would there be any conflict with the use of those movable rooms?
- RedWood's and Hotdog 2's section feel isolated. Dead end, argh!
- Hmm, performance dropped on Hotdog 2's map.
- Blowing up the explosive drums is fun.
- I wonder how it would play out with teleporters at the end of the existing unused possible entries/exits
- Overall, I think Riven has done a good job.
Here are some of my thoughts:
- Damn those hallways are boring, I really hope they are made shorter, less linear and way more interesting. I really hope we implement some crazy ideas such as the underwater idea or outer space etc for those hallways.
- Riven's map really slows down the gameplay, not that this is particularly a bad thing, but I wonder how it would play out with alot of players, would there be any conflict with the use of those movable rooms?
- RedWood's and Hotdog 2's section feel isolated. Dead end, argh!
- Hmm, performance dropped on Hotdog 2's map.
- Blowing up the explosive drums is fun.
- I wonder how it would play out with teleporters at the end of the existing unused possible entries/exits
- Overall, I think Riven has done a good job
.
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by G4MER on Tue Dec 2nd at 8:49pm 2008
Posted by G4MER on Tue Dec 2nd at 8:49pm 2008
How do I play DEMO's?
Oh crap I forgot to get you the award hallway!
Oh crap I forgot to get you the award hallway!
Re: Compilation Map 2008
Posted by Riven on Tue Dec 2nd at 9:33pm 2008
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Posted by Riven on Tue Dec 2nd at 9:33pm 2008
Thanks for the feedback aaron.
Ok, first things first: The hallways could potentially be pretty boring; I agree. But they have a lot of potential to really create interesting conflicts. That-is, if we use new concepts for DM. I was thinking of a moving ramp. You know, they kind you can stand on and they get you from one end of an airport the the other? Basically a conveyor belt? Well, imagine two conveyor belts that had a system of letting only one person on them at a time. and they were parallel with one another. Well, there could be a glass wall that separated both of them and there would be windows along the glass wall that would open up to allow for gun fire along the way. So if one person was following a weaker player and they both hop onto a conveyor belt, then one player could potentially even the odds by deploying off handed tactics, like walking in the opposite direction to 'stand still'.
-About Redwood's and Natus' maps; they will be connected to the train stations which is what I'm working on for Alpha2. Plus they will serve as the spawning grounds for blue and red team. So if there is teamplay enabled, then you will familiarize yourself with either of those two levels easily allowing them to become the most played areas of the level. The train will be split up into three stations. One station will connect to Natus' map, the middle one to aaron's and the last one to Redwoods. The train will go back and forth, and not loop. So it will be visiting aaron's map every 30 seconds or minute (depending on how fast it goes).
Just like in aaron's map, I performed a lot of work in hotdog's 2nd map (the cave). Essentially, the map was the box with all the displacements running at one time. Regardless of where you were in the level, your computer would have to render everything, even if you couldn't see it. To help this, I completely removed the outer walls to hotdog's map and began to break it down. I discovered several 'cut points' that I could create critical visleafs at in order to break up the rendering time. You will notice that as you travel to the top half of the map, it should run a little bit fast, because the bottom part should not be rendering. and vise versa when you are at the bottom part. I still had trouble (will need more tweaking) by not having the top portion render when you were in the great expanse half of the level. Standing there, everything renders and it is quite annoying considering how pivotal that area is. That's why your performance dropped there probably. It can be fixed, but I will need to tweak it for Alpha2.
-Yes, my map does slow down gameplay A LOT. It's very noticeable and I hope it becomes a tactic when players decide to enter that section. However, it could turn out to be not very fun and just a resource waster, but we'll see when the first beta comes out.
Future goals for Alpha2:
-Implement train portions of the map and train logistics.
-Work more on player clips and optimization in target areas.
-Test HDR possibilities :P
A few questions for playtesters:
-How do you like the fog? It's not thick enough to affect performance, so it can be taken out without repercussions. I've noticed it lightens up the level quite a bit. If you go and play the original entries (by themselves) you will notice they are all A LOT darker than their compilation counterparts. I for one prefer their lighter version. Perhaps I will take some screenshots later to demonstrate. Haymaker already commented a lot on the design, so hats off for him too!
-Thanks again (and let's see some more responses please!)
Quoting aaron_da_killa
- Damn those hallways are boring, I really hope they are made shorter, less linear and way more interesting. I really hope we implement some crazy ideas such as the underwater idea or outer space etc for those hallways.
- Riven's map really slows down the gameplay, not that this is particularly a bad thing, but I wonder how it would play out with alot of players, would there be any conflict with the use of those movable rooms?
- RedWood's and Hotdog 2's section feel isolated. Dead end, argh!
- Hmm, performance dropped on Hotdog 2's map.
- Blowing up the explosive drums is fun.
- I wonder how it would play out with teleporters at the end of the existing unused possible entries/exits
- Overall, I think Riven has done a good job smiley.
- Riven's map really slows down the gameplay, not that this is particularly a bad thing, but I wonder how it would play out with alot of players, would there be any conflict with the use of those movable rooms?
- RedWood's and Hotdog 2's section feel isolated. Dead end, argh!
- Hmm, performance dropped on Hotdog 2's map.
- Blowing up the explosive drums is fun.
- I wonder how it would play out with teleporters at the end of the existing unused possible entries/exits
- Overall, I think Riven has done a good job smiley.
Ok, first things first: The hallways could potentially be pretty boring; I agree. But they have a lot of potential to really create interesting conflicts. That-is, if we use new concepts for DM. I was thinking of a moving ramp. You know, they kind you can stand on and they get you from one end of an airport the the other? Basically a conveyor belt? Well, imagine two conveyor belts that had a system of letting only one person on them at a time. and they were parallel with one another. Well, there could be a glass wall that separated both of them and there would be windows along the glass wall that would open up to allow for gun fire along the way. So if one person was following a weaker player and they both hop onto a conveyor belt, then one player could potentially even the odds by deploying off handed tactics, like walking in the opposite direction to 'stand still'.
-About Redwood's and Natus' maps; they will be connected to the train stations which is what I'm working on for Alpha2. Plus they will serve as the spawning grounds for blue and red team. So if there is teamplay enabled, then you will familiarize yourself with either of those two levels easily allowing them to become the most played areas of the level. The train will be split up into three stations. One station will connect to Natus' map, the middle one to aaron's and the last one to Redwoods. The train will go back and forth, and not loop. So it will be visiting aaron's map every 30 seconds or minute (depending on how fast it goes).
Just like in aaron's map, I performed a lot of work in hotdog's 2nd map (the cave). Essentially, the map was the box with all the displacements running at one time. Regardless of where you were in the level, your computer would have to render everything, even if you couldn't see it. To help this, I completely removed the outer walls to hotdog's map and began to break it down. I discovered several 'cut points' that I could create critical visleafs at in order to break up the rendering time. You will notice that as you travel to the top half of the map, it should run a little bit fast, because the bottom part should not be rendering. and vise versa when you are at the bottom part. I still had trouble (will need more tweaking) by not having the top portion render when you were in the great expanse half of the level. Standing there, everything renders and it is quite annoying considering how pivotal that area is. That's why your performance dropped there probably. It can be fixed, but I will need to tweak it for Alpha2.
-Yes, my map does slow down gameplay A LOT. It's very noticeable and I hope it becomes a tactic when players decide to enter that section. However, it could turn out to be not very fun and just a resource waster, but we'll see when the first beta comes out.
Future goals for Alpha2:
-Implement train portions of the map and train logistics.
-Work more on player clips and optimization in target areas.
-Test HDR possibilities :P
A few questions for playtesters:
-How do you like the fog? It's not thick enough to affect performance, so it can be taken out without repercussions. I've noticed it lightens up the level quite a bit. If you go and play the original entries (by themselves) you will notice they are all A LOT darker than their compilation counterparts. I for one prefer their lighter version. Perhaps I will take some screenshots later to demonstrate. Haymaker already commented a lot on the design, so hats off for him too!
-Thanks again (and let's see some more responses please!)
Riven
super admin
1639 posts
802 snarkmarks
Registered: May 2nd 2005
Location: Austin, Texas, USA
Occupation: Architect
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