[map] Titanic
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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Thu Mar 22nd at 6:02am 2012


I keep meaning to ask but forget. How close to scale is this boat?



The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Thu Mar 22nd at 11:43am 2012


full scale smiley



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Captain Terror on Thu Mar 22nd at 11:50am 2012


I thought you were making the stacks from displacements?

Like G4m3er said they will be harder to make, but well worth the effort as they will be cheaper to render than models.

Also btw, that last hammer screen is really beautiful. I think you would benefit greatly from a multi-montior setup for this project, so you don't have to mouse-scroll-zoom for days and days to move from one end of the ship to the other smiley




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Thu Mar 22nd at 12:03pm 2012


Since there are only 4 stacks and hard to make, wouldn't it be better to make all the decks and/or flat surfaces into displacements? At the very least, all the flat surfaces that no one would ever see? There has got to be sections/areas that nobody will be in.

Even if not, people have been walking on displacements in almost all maps so I see no reason to make a hard shape to save surfaces when you can more readily make easy shapes faster.

There has gotta be a bazillion flat areas crying to be displaced. smiley




The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Thu Mar 22nd at 12:36pm 2012


Im unfamiliar with displacements so I'll have to Google that. I didnt even think to model the funnels, I probably should. I'd like to get a multi monitor setup though.. Maybe some day..

There arent a whole lot of areas in the ship that arent player accessible right now. The few would be the boiler casings, fidleys, and stokehold vents. All of which will be player accessible eventually as the fidleys would have been used as emergency escapes for the firemen in the boiler rooms.




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Thu Mar 22nd at 1:56pm 2012


Think of HL2. All the dirt, rocks, and most anything else on the ground was prolly displacements.
They aren't real hard to make but they are hard to get to look right. That's why I suggested flat surfaces. You ain't gotta do much but plonk them down and make sure no one can see under them.




The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by haymaker on Thu Mar 22nd at 9:06pm 2012


Dunno if you subscribe to Nat Geo, but

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/04/table-of-contents

April issue.




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Captain Terror on Thu Mar 22nd at 11:35pm 2012


That's a really good idea orph i never thought of using displacements like that smiley

WC i'm quite a nub with displacements myself, and i'm really just starting to use them in my maps.




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Fri Mar 23rd at 2:58am 2012


Thanks for the link haymaker. I'll have to buy that issue. I checked out the high res pics of the wreck.. Simply amazing.

I finally discovered visgrouping tonight, and its made viewing a lot easier. And also allows me to finally post a top-down view of each deck:





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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Fri Mar 23rd at 11:09am 2012


Just discovered vis grouping. You do know that we are online every night, right? smiley



The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Captain Terror on Fri Mar 23rd at 9:55pm 2012


LOL ya, visgouping is the bomb. I'm so dependent on Hammer 4 visgrouping now, going back to do anything in gsource is really painful smiley


Also great screens btw! (i need a dual-screen setup just to view half the ship properly =P




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Fri Mar 23rd at 10:38pm 2012


Actually, Im pretty sure visgrouping has been around since the HL1 days, but I only now started using it!

I kinda wish I could work expense this project lol. Already had to shell out 40 bucks for FRAPS and 100 for the books from Bruce.




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Sat Mar 24th at 3:13pm 2012


Well, its time to start planning the splitting of the map into multiple maps. We'll see how this goes.

[edit]
Started the split working on the Boat Deck first. And will continue top-down. I will be splitting each deck into a separate level as best as possible I think.

With that, I've listed phase 1 as complete, and I've changed the scope of phase 2 to be simply the level splitting and basic optimization which will allow (hopefully) for full compiles of each.




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Mar 24th at 10:23pm 2012


Keep an unbroken version. I bet there are gobs of optimization you are unaware of.
Hell, you prolly haven't even tried the displacements yet.




The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Sat Mar 24th at 11:12pm 2012


Yea. I didnt do much. But the error Im getting seems to have only as solution to remove detail from the map. And given that none of the actual rooms are built yet, nor are any of the details put in (ceilings, railings, lighting, furniture, etc). I know I'll have to split it



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Sat Mar 24th at 11:19pm 2012


I'd still look into optimization. There are some tuts here. Think of it this way. Some of the maps in HL2 were HUGE. They had way more detail than you currently have. If they can do it, so can you. WAY MORE THAN YOU.

I am betting you would be better served reading some tuts instead of figuring out where would be the best place to chop the map into bits without ruining the goal of your project.




The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Sat Mar 24th at 11:55pm 2012


That is very true. I spent maybe two hours or so working the Boat Deck and it is a bit of an annoyance to split the map..

But I need to fix that error..




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Sun Mar 25th at 1:48pm 2012


I've tried turning a lot more into models with no effect, still getting the error. I've reduced the brush count by around 1000 or so and faces by a lot more.

I propper'ed the following:

- all funnels
- dome over aft grand staircase
- dome over fore grand staircase
- mainmast
- foremast
- railings at fore grand staircase at boat deck

I dont quite like modelling though as the models dont end up being the same dimensions as the original brushes. For instance, the funnels are 582w 305l 992h, however the model ends up being 582.5w 305.5l 992.5h which is a tad annoying as for some of the models, such as the railings, they dont fit perfectly like brushes did.

In any case, the error is still there. If I block out parts of the map, I can get the error to disappear, and then I get a Tjunction error: Too many t-junctions to fix up! (3048 prims, max 32768 :: 65541 indices, max 65536) which as best I can tell is caused by too many func_detail brushes touching world brushes.

Im well below the engine limits as far as I can tell... Now at 7707 brushes and 46799 faces.

I *was* able to get a normal compile (fast VVIS) but I had to block out all decks bellow D Deck (D, E, F, G, Orlop, Tank Top). Not exactly a solution.

[edit]
On a slightly positive note, I was able to get a full compile (full VVIS and full VRAD) with allow the decks bellow D blocked out, and FPS never dropped bellow 300 except for at the extreme ends of the maps where they flirted with 299. Not sure if thats accurate or not.. I couldnt get mat_wireframe 1 to work though.




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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Orpheus on Sun Mar 25th at 3:42pm 2012


What other sites have you posted this on?
I am sure there are solutions, you just need the right people looking AND commenting. Right now, the vast majority of Snarkpit users look and little else.




The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: [map] Titanic
Posted by Wild Card on Mon Mar 26th at 12:51am 2012


Posted this on VDC: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2617039

But looks like the answer there is (surprise surprise) to split the level..





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