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Dungeon Death
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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Dark Tree on Tue Nov 2nd at 6:10pm 2004

Hey Guys. I submitted a few maps yesterday. This being one of them. This is my first SP map and I put about 2-3 months work in it. There are 2 dungeons and one church area. First, you must find a bible, then a sword, then find dungeon two. It may be pretty difficult to find out how to get to the sword, so if anyone has trouble completing the objectives, PM or email me and I can send you some links to demos. I implemented direct references to DOOM, Zelda, and Quake. The point of the game is to exit the dungeon. But, as you know, the name of the map is Dungeon Death, so, of course it won't be easy. The only real bug I can think of is a clipping error that may occur when a certain trigger_changelevel happens.

After playing, comments/critiques would be greatly appreciated.

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Tue Nov 2nd at 8:14pm 2004

screens:

1) file size to big.. Xat is calling to you.
2) link broken
3) file size to big.. Xat is calling to you.
4)screen in fine
5) link broken

[edit]

screens of 800x600 are preferred, but 1024x768 is acceptable.
800x600 will reduce to around 50k
1024x768 will reduce to around 75k

anyone who is not getting these numbers is prolly not using XAT..
i have heard so many great things about so many other programs, and yet, the file sizes of them are close to double of XAT.. *shrugs* some people are just slow to catch on i reckon.

anywho's at least try to get the broken links up.. we can work on file sizes when you get a program that will suffice

[edit 2] i went ahead and made this really big, so it would not be continued overlooked..

i would hope that advice this good being overlooked is not indicative of how much attention a maps advice will be taken

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Tue Nov 2nd at 9:02pm 2004

Dammmn tracer, and you are one of our easiest to please types too..

musta been somethin..

/me awaits more comments..

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Tue Nov 2nd at 9:27pm 2004

back when doc still acted white, i did a critique for him, the last time BTW, but to make a long story short, it was compiling issues that did it.. his construction was always a bit nasty, but you could tell it and over look it.. but that particular map had issues that were not explained easilly..

look at the numbers on this screen you posted.. the numbers do NOT support 11 fps.. that tells me there is an underlying issue, most likely compiling.. try it again, with gl_wireframe 1 and 2 on.. see what its seeing and maybe then..

i have played 1900+epolies before, i have played 5000+ epolies before with numbers higher in fps.. there is something else wrong than construction i bet.

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Tue Nov 2nd at 9:36pm 2004

ok, enlighten me, what are dynamic lights? [addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Tracer Bullet on Tue Nov 2nd at 9:44pm 2004

Dynamic lights are um... lights that have dynamic settings

Any light that is set to "flicker" or some such causes this problem. You just can't have very many of them in one scene. I think what happens is that the compiler has to make a separate lightmap for each state of the light, so when you have flickering or fading light it has to continually load and reload the appropriate lightmaps. I.e. dark/in between/light. The other possibility as that the engine calculates the lighting values on the fly, and just adds them to the static lightmap that the compiler produces. Either way, you can see how you are going to take a major performance hit. In the first case it is a RAM issue, in the second, a CPU issue, and I'm not sure what actually happens.

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Captain P on Tue Nov 2nd at 9:48pm 2004

Perhaps 'animated light' is a better word here? Dunno...

I think it's all done during the RAD process. That would indicate why you can't have more than 3 lightstyles on the same face, e.g. it would become nearly impossible to calculate all possible lightmaps, let alone what would happen in-game.
[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Tue Nov 2nd at 9:49pm 2004

OK, then, thats what i thought.. now.. go dload my map Double_Trouble and post a screenshot of the castle area.. there are two or three each on those torches.. i think its three.. but i want to see your r_speeds..

i have a sissy comp and it runs smooth in there..

now if it runs smooth on yours too.. then i bet its a compiling issue..

while you are there, rate the map

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Dark Tree on Tue Nov 2nd at 10:17pm 2004

I'm sorry...but I do get a smooth 50+ fps on a 1.54 GHz machine....There should be no areas in the map where the map is unplayably slow [addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by NotLagur2 on Tue Nov 2nd at 10:20pm 2004

I like the concept. You should make this map for svencoop. AFTER improving it.



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Tracer Bullet on Tue Nov 2nd at 10:23pm 2004

Allrighty then. My bad. I underestimated the effects of having MS word running in the background.

I stand by what I said about dynamic lights though, be carfull with those things. Among other things they can induce seziures in the unwary. I'll do a propper critique when the burning red recedes from my ears. You might say this was a "slnky" day for me. Thanks Orph.

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Tue Nov 2nd at 10:32pm 2004

so? i take it D_T run pretty good? [addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Dark Tree on Tue Nov 2nd at 11:01pm 2004

Yeah...I know I need to make things less blocky....I was going more for concept and having fun making it hard to get to the end of the maze/traps/objectives. I tried to implementate a lot of non traditional ideas...I will be back tommorrow with better working links, etc.

? quote:
so? i take it D_T run pretty good?

I'm sorry...I don't understand

EDIT:

Also...I relinked my jpegs and toned them down to 800x600

EDIT 2:

Weird...all links work but not all pictures were properly resized...I converted all of my screenshots with AP7 and yet the link is still somehow some are mysteriously linking to the phantom 1024x768 imgs I deleted....

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Dark Tree on Wed Nov 3rd at 9:07pm 2004

So basically the idea for my next map should be

~Not to be so crappy~

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Wed Nov 3rd at 9:22pm 2004





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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Orpheus on Wed Nov 3rd at 9:44pm 2004

? quoting Dark Tree

So basically the idea for my next map should be

~Not to be so crappy~

tracer bullet is one of our best critique writers, give him a chance to get the last of the foot taste washed out of his mouth, and perhaps he will fulfill his promise to write one up for you..

remember though, finished maps do not receive the level of attention as work in progress ones.. so you may not get a really big critique.

[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Dark Tree on Wed Nov 3rd at 9:53pm 2004

If he (or anyone is willing) to critique my map and give me some usefull ideas (ie change lighting stlyes) and stuff like that...I still have my RMFs and would be willing to re-engineer my map to make it look a lot better and more playable. I did want to just quit building it....as I had been working on the 3 bsps for about 4 months. But if Tracer thinks it is reperable...than I could give it a go. I do aim to please and would like a many to play and enjoy this map. So I will change my map from being completed to maybe 75% done so I can re-texture and redesign it so it doesn't create "headaches." [addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Spartan on Wed Nov 3rd at 10:26pm 2004

The levels look bland and the lighting needs to be fixed... a lot. Also align the brick texture on the inside of that round stair case.



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Captain P on Wed Nov 3rd at 11:38pm 2004

In it's current state, the mappack is indeed very bland. Not only architecture and lighting look like they've gotten little attention or tweaking, the traps and puzzles could also have been executed better.

I see a quite common problem here. Puzzles without clues and traps without warnings. This will often annoy the player instead of amuse him. Hiding a key behind a moveable wall without any sign is surely a good way to hide it. But a player won't be happy when he's stuck in your level... wich he will likely get.
I don't say: give the player a walk-trough beforehand, but I do want to stress that you need to give the player some sort of idea on what has to be done. Let your puzzles appear logical, so a player can find a solution to them without having to know how the map was built.

As for the story's end... personally I find such endings little satisfying... after all, you had to play trough some levels and all you get in reward is... death...
I've had it once in a mod called 'Case Closed'. It really buggered me off, finding out I would be killed in the end anyway...

Oh, and I would advise you to search for some reference pictures. It can help you to get your levels look more convincing...
[addsig]



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 Re: Dungeon Death
Posted by Dark Tree on Thu Nov 4th at 7:24pm 2004

My problem was....I downloaded a map called 'Winter Maze'. It was a holiday-seasoned maze map. It was small and too easy to beat....no monsters...easy maze. So I decided to make a maze of my own....I originally was only going to spend ONE night one it...just for fun to whip up a big maze (hence the rectangular dungeons). As I spent 1 day...then 2...then 3....I realized I wanted to spent a little more time on it...so as I went on the map got more into detail....but seeing as it was only supposed to be a one day project to begin w/, I didn't feel the need to go back and fix what I already did. And now...well....time to get to work, lol.

ps: Thank you very much, Cap'n for your map sugg's

Edit:

Are there any pieces of the map that are good?

[addsig]




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