dm_babble
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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Sun Jun 26th at 8:01am 2005


I was hoping to see more competition entries, but I guess it's up to Paladin[NL] and me to start things off then, yes? Come on, people, it's a Snarkpit competition! Wake up and get mapping!
So, anyway, some notes:
  • Cel-shading is gone. Too much work for something that's just icing on a cake. Maybe I'll do it if I have time left over, but I doubt it.
  • Screenshots: 1st is before. 2nd is in-editor. 3rd is in-game.
  • Yes, I know the roof tile texture looks radioactive. I wanted to it to be shiny and such, but there's too much sky and the cubemaps just end up looking really bright. Argh.
  • Still some dev_ textures left over. They actually work pretty well for laying things out.
  • Framerate is looking good. Few textures use normal maps (it makes the textures look too realistic) if at all, so it's basically just generic lightmapped brushes.
  • There are no cartoony static props with exaggerated proportions. This is all pretty much going to be brushwork. But what am I going to do for physic props? I'm pretty sure func_physboxes aren't going to work too well.
  • The sky will be replaced with a more cartoony one. Somehow.
  • Environmental lighting is temporary. I think I want to do an evening setting instead, with orange-light torches (like last year). I don't like bright sunlight - while it's definitely more cartoony, it kind of washes everything out. Or maybe I just suck with picking out daylight colors.
Comments? Questions? Insults?




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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Orpheus on Sun Jun 26th at 10:06am 2005


I am sleepy, so I will comment more thoughtful later. For now the only thing that sticks out is "10%" completed.. just how big is this thing gonna get CJ?



The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Myrk- on Sun Jun 26th at 10:14am 2005


TBH, it doesn't look suited for the competition at all! Its quite a pheasable building, unless something really, really crazy is gunna happen with the insides or something... Thats probably why not many people are entering the contest- no one wants to make custom textures, and making a really unbelievable, crazy map is hard. Takes a while to think of a good idea.


-[Better to be Honest than Kind]-



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by habboi on Sun Jun 26th at 10:35am 2005


The sky will be replaced with a more cartoony one. Somehow

Make some sky textures and just make a sky brush...
Anyway looks good! Why doesn't it suit the compo?
Custom textures are a lot of work but to be honest it needs new models like a melting clock to be successful.

About your map:

It looks a bit blocky at the back but of course you are going to add to that <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">
I really like the Persia feel to it so goodluck.





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Re: dm_babble
Posted by G.Ballblue on Sun Jun 26th at 5:31pm 2005


Whoo hoo! I remember when you were working hardcore on this map last year, so I was taken a little off guard to see that you're working on it again!

While I haven't actually seen your precentage bar myself, just how big are you going to make this map? If there is a way to generate a number, (I'm not particularly familiar with HL2 mapping) then how many brushes have you used?

As far I can tell from the screens, the only thing I would suggest would be to work out some of the blockiness -- this map, if anything, could definetely benefit from the use of models. The map doesn't look bad or anything -- very nice in fact -- but it looks a little Half-Life onenissh...... (screen 3)




Breaking the laws of mapping since 2003 and doing a damn fine job at it



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Loco on Sun Jun 26th at 5:59pm 2005


Only thing I'd say is lighting. There's a really good tutorial here. Other than that - wow.






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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Orpheus on Sun Jun 26th at 6:10pm 2005


I have lost count of how many times I have not done a critique for you CJ.. If you want one, you will have to request it from me this time..

/ comment.





The best things in life, aren't things.



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Sun Jun 26th at 6:51pm 2005


Oops. Progress bar is more like 40 or 50, I forgot to update it. Which actually brings me to one of my goals for this year's entry: don't make it so damn big. I'm actually kind of proud of the restraint I'm showing <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">

Myrk: Good point. I'm still trying to decide what exactly I want to do. But I have a few ideas though that should be "surreal" enough, hopefully.

Everyone else: Sorry, I can't model, it's just going to be hardcore VM. And thanks for that lighting tutorial (although I disagree with the writer; we can't all make happy, sunlight-filled DM maps! it's like that overused orange sunset skybox, too much of it already in the community)




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Re: dm_babble
Posted by satchmo on Sun Jun 26th at 9:20pm 2005


I am glad you're making progress on this map. It used to be on my watchlist for a while, until I took it off a week ago. It has been dormant for so long that I thought you've given up on it.

Looking good so far. I am sure you're still tweaking the lighting, so I won't make any comments at this point. The architecture looks magnificent though.




"The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." -- Toulouse-Lautre, Moulin Rouge



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by BlisTer on Sun Jun 26th at 9:57pm 2005


continuing the persia theme; never change a winning horse eh? <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">

i agree with myrk though: what's unreal ? so i wonder what things you're gonna add to make it "a place that you would never encounter"




These words are my diaries screaming out loud



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Sun Jun 26th at 11:53pm 2005


A night version. Not really liking how the torches came out, but oh well. Also threw together a three-dee skybocks for fun.

I think I'll distort the hell out of the indoor portion, but keep this outdoor portion relatively normal so the player knows that it's supposed to be some kind of palace.

EDIT: Oops, forgot the screenshot.






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Re: dm_babble
Posted by nooba on Mon Jun 27th at 10:05am 2005


CJ, i could make you some models, if you tell me what you would like. You'd have to skin them though :P Contact me through PM/Msn/Email and i'll see what i can do <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif"> Click here to see some models i made. (NOTE: Ignore the garbage skin)



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by habboi on Tue Jun 28th at 3:52pm 2005


Come to think of it, it sorta looks like 'Kingdom Hearts' style...Nice one!



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Spartan on Tue Jun 28th at 5:15pm 2005


Campaignjunkie you should really consider getting a job at Blizzard as a level designer. Your style fits Blizzard's type of levels. In fact I think they are looking for level designers.




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Re: dm_babble
Posted by ReNo on Tue Jun 28th at 6:32pm 2005


"Consider getting a job at Blizzard" You make it sound so easy! Not to suggest that CJ hasn't got the skills of course If he'd actually try learning to model that is

Maps looking not bad so far, but I preferred it in HL1. Back then it was jaw dropping in scale and stature, but now it feels far less so. Lighting could certainly use work - ambient light level seems a bit high in that night shot, though the lamps look pretty nice. Overall design is nice and I like the more exaggerated shapes you are working in, with leaning walls and whatnot giving a nice imposing feel to the place in a cartoony way. I'd be inclined to suggest losing some of the detail in the textures that is creating repetition, as it is quite noticeable at the moment. If you have access to it, play the Wind Waker and check out the Forsaken Fortress near the start for perhaps some more ideas, even if it doesn't quite match your theme.

I'm afraid I'm gonna have to echo the others thoughts about models - this could really benefit from them. Having drapes between pillars that are simply masked textures doesn't really cut it anymore, and while it added some welcome detail to the map in HL1, it just looks out of place in HL2. Grab milkshape and have a go - I'll bet you won't find it as daunting or difficult as you seem to be expecting.






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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Spartan on Tue Jun 28th at 7:47pm 2005


Campaignjunkie, do you make all your own textures or do you have one of those keebler elves locked away in your room making them?




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Re: dm_babble
Posted by ReNo on Tue Jun 28th at 7:51pm 2005


Random idea: fireworks. The in game view looks like it would be awesome with fireworks <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Would also completely set your map apart from any others I've seen in...well...anything really. Dunno how it would best be achieved - sprites are a bit old school and perhaps not suited to all angles they could be seen from, but I've no idea about how effective (or possible) any sort of custom particle systems are in source without resorting to actual coding.






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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Tue Jun 28th at 10:05pm 2005


- Okay, since everyone thinks it needs models, I'm inclined to agree and I'm going to try to learn the model pipeline and such. I was kind of putting it off because I'm doubtful I'll have time for the deadline, but I guess it's neccesary.

- I make all of my own textures. Before I would rework photos from Mayang and such, but that wasn't producing very cartoony results, so now I find myself painting more often. A Wacom really helps!

- Fireworks sound crazy enough to work. I'll look into it. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_wink.gif">

Geeze, this competition is turning into a lot more work than I thought. But I guess that's a good thing? <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">




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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Myrk- on Tue Jun 28th at 11:35pm 2005


The thing I feel needs modelling the most are the tops of the buildings- BUT, a time saver....

De_dust for CS:S has domes and such, look into its props... You could always just reskin the de_dust props.




-[Better to be Honest than Kind]-



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Re: dm_babble
Posted by Campaignjunkie on Tue Jun 28th at 11:43pm 2005


I thought it was illegal to redistribute CS:S assets?





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