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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Fri Feb 23rd at 11:53pm 2007

Hey reaper. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

You're right about the upper floors. I was originally going to try to keep them intact (because the player won't have access to them) but it's gonna be way harder to do in a visually-correct way. I'll demolish them. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Rubble.. the ground on each level is covered in rubble (decalwise) but looking up from below doesn't show that, I need to do the ceilings too <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Plus all sorts of hanging/falling crap. Gimme a few days. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

Nice to hear from you, stay tuned. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Sun Feb 25th at 10:03pm 2007

Ok, I rubbled it up a bit!

Shot 1 - From the ground looking up. Added lots of decals for scorchmarks, plus scattered some fires around and just a little bit of rebar sticking out in places (to be improved). Still need a bunch more chunks all over the place, but it's getting better.

Shot 2, from afar.

Shot 3, from above, so you can see my delicious decalwork.

Any thoughts? <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by Orpheus on Sun Feb 25th at 10:12pm 2007

? quoting midkay
Any thoughts?

Fires that big would either:

1)consume their fuel quickly.
2)burn the building down to the ground.

Is there no way t scale them to mere flickers?





The best things in life, aren't things.



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by Stadric on Sun Feb 25th at 11:35pm 2007

Needs some rubble, either with displacements or with props.


Also change the texture of the dock. Docks are rarely tile. -Facepunch
As I Lay Dying



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Sun Feb 25th at 11:36pm 2007

Hi Orph, it's been a while.

I guess that's true with about any fire in a game.. but I think you're right, I can definitely resize them and I'll try them out much smaller (1/2 to even 1/4 size of that) and see how it looks.

Thanks.

-edit-

And Stadric <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> It's in the works...


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Mon Mar 12th at 4:54am 2007

Hi guys. Here's a not-quite-brief update on this map...

Over the past few days I've managed to get quite some touch-up work done on this map. All sorts of little things that were bugging me and that were on the to-do list got done. I did a lot of adjustment to the lighting and lightmapping as well in order to take the visual quality up a bit. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> I'll let a few images show some of what the map looks like as of right now:

Screen 1; a little bit of the lightmapping and lighting work I've done. It's still sunrise, but a brighter one, and the streetlights are a bit brighter as well. Sharper, clearer shadows from streetlights and buildings fall across the ground and walls.

Screen 2; a bit more lighting work. HDR is a must for this map or else you'll miss out on the soft orange glows of the sun.

Screen 3; the destroyed building a bit more refined. Shrunk most of the fires, there are just a couple larger ones now. Lots of interior work you can't see here.. I'll show that off soon. In the background: more work on the construction building...

Screen 5; not too much to see here. This is just how everything looks back here right now...

Screen 5; some very important work done here. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Lots more woodwork going on with the construction building - easier to kill anyone up there with a rocket. Also a little harder to navigate up there if you're running around. Lightmapping is crucial to this area, so I took it up quite a bit - especially on the flat wooden surface to the left. Again, HDR is important - the brighter sunlight creates some really great-looking orange/pink glows.

That's all the screenshots for now. I really feel like I'm getting a lot of work done and I really really really want to push out a beta 2 within a few days or a week, if I can stay focused on fixes and necessary improvements rather than additions. The todo list is shrinking. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Also want to let you know that I've uploaded an archive of all of the old images I've used in these posts at http://www.midkay.net/dm_residential - the numbered folders are "groups" of shots used in single-post updates. Promo folders are "dm_residential by midkay"-stamped. Enjoy some earlier shots if you wish. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

Any thoughts/suggestions at all are welcome as always. Talk to you again very soon. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by reaper47 on Mon Mar 12th at 9:05am 2007

I like the new, clean look. But I still think you should try and move a bit outside the rectangle shape of this destroyed building to add some rubble and debris on the street beneath it. Considering the building still burns (and even if it doesn't) it looks odd that the street beneath it is completely clean. The material from the destruction has to go somewhere outside the building also. Here's a sketch of what I mean:

image

The wooden construction site could need some asymmetry, too. It's too boxy. Maybe the top part could be bit more "unfinished"?

Higher Lightmap resolution create some nice, sharp shadows. I had to learn the hard way, though, that they also create megabytes of additional BSP filesize. Make sure to keep brushfaces with high resolution as small as possible.

PS: I got to play the former version of this map yesterday and it was fun. I can see the changes you did really pay of in gameplay.


Why snark works.



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Mon Mar 12th at 4:28pm 2007

Thanks reaper. Point by point...

That drawing is useful. Rubble around that are is an important to-do and would be good for gameplay as an alternate way to access the destroyed pirtion of that building as shown in your sketch. So that's something I'll work on before a beta 2.

Construction site... good idea. some unfinished, uneven beams etc... sounds good. Thanks - would not have thought of that. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

And gameplaywise... thanks for the beta 1 comment, but I think you'll enjoy beta 2 much more. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Much more flow and variation.



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Mon Mar 12th at 4:29pm 2007

Thanks reaper. Point by point...

That drawing is useful. Rubble around that are is an important to-do and would be good for gameplay as an alternate way to access the destroyed pirtion of that building as shown in your sketch. So that's something I'll work on before a beta 2.

Construction site... good idea. some unfinished, uneven beams etc... sounds good. Thanks - would not have thought of that. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

And gameplaywise... thanks for the beta 1 comment, but I think you'll enjoy beta 2 much more. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> Much more flow and variation.



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Wed Mar 14th at 7:21am 2007

Sigh. This rubble stuff is hard!

I spent an hour or so today just messing around with a rough layout for the rubble.. I got nowhere. I tried a huge (like stories tall) chunk of wall fallen across the road.. not too easy to pull off realistically. Some smaller pieces painstakingly attached to each other with rebar.. looks unrealistic, hard to do. Hmm.

I'll probably have to use displacements one way or another.. but I'm just not sure where I can go with this yet. I'll probably need tons of rubble/debris/rock props as well.. *ponders*.


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Thu Mar 15th at 4:19am 2007

Quick quick 30-minutes-of-work early alpha preview shots! <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

Shot 1... what I'll build off of to create the debris from the screwed-up building.

Shot 2 and Shot 3 - did some tweaking of the construction site for you, reaper47. Is this what you had in mind?

Thoughts are very welcome.. but remember these are very very unfinished shots. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by reaper47 on Thu Mar 15th at 9:49am 2007

You have to look very closely to even notice the missing beams at the construction site. It would be nice, when watching the construction site from a distance, to not see a big rectangle of beams but more an organic shape with one side totally unfinished, for example.

This shot looks good. I'd just use a neutral, gray texture for the big wall debris (the red/white paint looks unrealistic) and also a bit of destruction for the dark, gray basement wall. It's completely clean, not even a crack. It looks odd.

btw. Is that roof made of 3 meters of solid concrete? Maybe it's just the perspective...

Man, this building is a lot of work. Maybe you should step back for a moment and re-think if it needs all that detail. Together with the many beams at the construction site, you have a lot of small polygons and that could become a performance issue.

I assume you hate me now. Sorry. <:]


Why snark works.



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Fri Mar 16th at 1:00am 2007

@ reaper47:

Construction building - that's true. I'll see what I can do.. remove all the horizontal beams on the top and make it more uneven overall. Just wait! image

"This shot" - let me show you what I've got now (see third shot below). The basement wall could use some destruction.. but I'll have to do some major work to allow that. So give me a few days or something. image And the roof: solid concrete that is! For now at least. image

The building itself.. I think it's necessary. I just felt like it seemed so boring to have a bunch of small jagged holes in walls, just large enough for the player to fit through. This is way more fun and visually-interesting, I think. FPSwise, I think it should be fine. The destruction is quite coarse and it should stay that way.. the construction building isn't a very big deal right now, and it should get even less detail when I trim it back a bit. FPS is way way way better than beta 1 anyways.. I think there's no reason to worry, at least not about this.

And I still love you and your comments! image

So here's a few shots I took on the latest compile..

Apartment buildings with some top-lighting.
Destroyed building and construction site from afar..
Destroyed building and street debris, a bit more detailed and varied now. Still gotta dirty up these textures and more rubble, etc etc etc..
Construction site.. I added some spotlights at the left for some nice light and shadow play on the ground and wall.

Thoughts welcome as always. image


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Sat Mar 17th at 6:35am 2007

Here's a few brand new shots:

Debris at destroyed building. Using various gray concrete textures now.. thanks for the suggestion, reaper47, wouldn't have tried it but it looks great I think. Also added lots of decals and trash. Maybe a little too much trash? Anyways, I feel like it's looking pretty good now.

Debris from above. Construction site in background, here are some close ups:

Shots one, two, and three of the construction site. Much more unfinished... er.. less finished.. whatever. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif"> What do you think, reaper47?

That's about it for now. I actually really want to make a minute-long or so flyaround video of the latest compile or so to show off the whole level and its flow.. so I might create and put up something like that soon.


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by Elon Yariv on Sat Mar 17th at 8:42am 2007

I think the griders in a construction site are made of steel. You should ask kasperg, he sometimes hangs around here, he is an architect, so he knows.

By the way the lower ledge of the destroyed building next to the debris, it is now damaged at all, which seem highly unlikely to happen. Cut off the edge of that ledge.


Elon Yariv



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by reaper47 on Sat Mar 17th at 10:57am 2007

Looking good now, midkay!

My complaint about the undestroyed basement stays. Maybe instead of cutting up the basement you could build some more cracked walls above it. Like 32 Units high. It's mainly the 90? horizontal ledge that looks odd.


Why snark works.



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Sat Mar 17th at 11:19am 2007

Thanks for your prompt responses <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

At both of you: As far as the basement being undestroyed.. this is still a definite to-do. I haven't got time to invest the probably-hour-or-so I'll need to fully implement such destruction - I'm just off to bed - but I'll do it tomorrow most likely.

Elon: About the steel girders.. hmm. I've seen lots of construction sites where the framework is entirely (or mostly) wood.. but I'm no architect, and it may be different for large apartment-type buildings. So I can change it to metal if anything is found out about this. I'll do some research tomorrow.

Thanks again.. talk to you all tomorrow. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by Trapt on Sun Mar 18th at 12:22am 2007

The rubble looks decent. I'd recommend looking at dm_overwatch again just to see how VALVe pulled it off. The only thing I don't like about the destroyed building is the jagged edges, it just looks... crappy, to be honest. Give it more sides and make it less zig-zaggy, and it'll look loads better.

And yeah, I'd go for steel on the construction site. I'm sure wood works, but the texture doesn't look right. Either experiment with other wood textures or change it to steel trusses.

Lovin' the shadows the wood framework makes though, good job on that.


I seem to have done toilet on your floor



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Sun Mar 18th at 6:46am 2007

Hey Trapt, thanks for the suggestions. I think you're right, I'll try and make the destruction a bit higher-poly. And I guess I'll try steel in the construction site too. Not sure what sort of architectural changes that'll require though...

And thanks for the shadow compliment.. *loves high res lightmaps* <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">


-- midkay



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 Re: dm_residential
Posted by midkay on Thu Jul 5th at 7:55am 2007

Hey guys!

Boy, it's been a while. School's out now - been out for almost two weeks. And dm_residential's first anniversary passed as well - it's now been in-the-works for a couple weeks over a year.

That's why I've decided it's about time to finish it up. <img src=" SRC="images/smiles/icon_smile.gif">

Assuming there are no unexpected errors or crashes whilst I compile dm_residential tonight, I'll be releasing a beta 2 tomorrow. I've been doing quite some work the past few days in order to prepare for this. I'm nearly satisfied with everything, and so as I'm really close to calling it "finished" I'd like to give a beta 2 a couple weeks so I can get any and all feedback in to the map before I put out a final version.

Side note: I had a little laugh yesterday when I read the dm_residential_b1 readme, in which I said, "This is a beta release. Most of the layout is finished. Most of the details are not." In retrospect, dm_residential_b2 couldn't look and play more different from b1. It's hardly recognizable, except for the evening-lighting style.

I'll probably end up putting up some b2 screenshots tonight, or otherwise, tomorrow shortly before or when the b2 version is released.


-- midkay




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