The moment you have all been waiting for!

Its the moment that you all have been waiting for!  Atleast I was....anyway, I just released a new map called op4_sibber.  Look it up in the maps section and tell me what you think.  Pics are on the way.  Mind you this is my first out door map... so be nice! :smile:  I also updated my website so my downloads are in zip format now...i knew i would get around to it sooner or later. Let me know what you guys think if you download it.  Like i said, pics are on the way!

Boy...this has been a long time coming huh.  Here are the pics of op4_sibbur (incase your wondering, its rubbish spelled backwards without the "h" :biggrin: ).  Have fun, and remember its my first out door map, so....ah, who cares!  Mutilate it!!! I need to get better...desperatly.  Not really, but thats kinda why i joined .

 









 

I like the detailing - the broken pillars are neat.

There are a couple of things that make this look very much like a  map rather than a real place.  Often maps try to look real, to make them feel more immersive.  If not, they usually go for a very obviously "unreal" theme - such as a cartoon.

If you want to make it feel like a real place, don't hollow out a giant box to contain your level.  Also, don't make supporting walls and floors paper-thin.

:biggrin: Thanks for the input Gollum, i really appreciate It!!! :biggrin:

Just out of curiousity, what do you mean by detailing?  I figured i did something right cus you liked it, i just don't know what it is that i did.

Well just because I like it doesn't mean it was right :wink:

What I meant by the detailing is those broken bits of stone and pillars.  You can see them best in the first shot, on the right.  They make for interesting shapes - the rest of the map is pretty boxy.

Just spotted the slightly bumpy terrain; again, I think this is good because it makes the map look less like a box and more like a place.

WOO HOO!!! I ALMOST DID SOMETHING RIGHT!!! :biggrin:

Thats awsome, im glad that im doing something that makes it look like a place and not a map... i will keep these things in mind for my other out door maps.

Er sorry, I meant to say LAST shot not first.

/slaps self

Read the tutorial on making cliffs, your map will benefit greatly from it.

I'm not sure if this map has the r's for detailed cliffs, and it would be quite difficult to get them in there.  But anyway you can try, and it's a good resource for later maps.

Sim said:
I'm not sure if this map has the r's for detailed cliffs, and it would be quite difficult to get them in there.  But anyway you can try, and it's a good resource for later maps.

good point, but IMO at this stage of his career, r's are the least of his worries..

i doubt this map will see completion, so anything he throws into it, would surly benefit his practice at mapping..

i suggest tho, in a future endeavor.. work on visblocking.. as sim pointed out.. cliffs at this stage of this map, will never work :sad:

/2 cents

heh, my first map one of my friends came over and attempted to use Worldcraft as a 3d modeling tool to construct a giant stone statue out front of a building.  Without windows.  I assume r_speeds were through the roof, and it had a lot of errors.  A 'fro made of spheres is something you should avoid in Hammer... Also the floors were paper thin, the lighting was entirely light_environment, and weapon placement was horrid.

Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeemorieeeeeeeeeeeeees...

Hornpipe, are you talking about my map...?!  I thought weapon placement was awsome, if you noticed its balanced out, and spread out over the entire map, so you can always get a weapon, mabey not your favorite, but a weapon....

Hornpipe2 said:
heh, my first map one of my friends came over and attempted to use Worldcraft as a 3d modeling tool to construct a giant stone statue out front of a building.  Without windows.  I assume r_speeds were through the roof, and it had a lot of errors.  A 'fro made of spheres is something you should avoid in Hammer... Also the floors were paper thin, the lighting was entirely light_environment, and weapon placement was horrid.

Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeemorieeeeeeeeeeeeees...

haha, that looks a lot like my first first map ever, it was basically a big swamp of a large area with a compilation of every tutorial I had taken in a week. Happily it had disappeared in the big format of '01. I didn't map for a year after it, then started and I suppose I'm at a fairly good skill right now. First maps aren't usually a good indicator for your true potential, basically learn from every little detail in your map.

Just a few points which may help make your maps a little better..

 

• Crates. Ok, crates exist, but not in vast quantities spread over several places (unless it is one giant storehouse). Try and use other things to fill up the space, take a look around when you next pass construction sites and so forth..
• Shot #1. The outer wall of the building looks paper thin.. for realism, make it thicker - the whole place would collapse with walls like that. Also, ( I think ) thicker brushes compile more quickly!
• Shot #1. Doors/Windows. Frames for doors and windows, even if texture based rather than extensive detailing with brushes helps to break up the monotony and make it feel "real".
• All shots. It looks like a (fairly simple) compound of some kind for the military.. ok, it may be your first attempt and a little lacking but it is a good theme to play and experiment with. Try adding roads, make the outer wall go round corners and raise and lower. Add guard booths, "uniform" barracks.. Try and cut the empty space down and turn into something which looks and feels more real. Just have a look at films with this kind of thing on, I'm sure theres good war films with this kind of location! If not, try Opposing Force, take a look at the bootcamp :smile:
• Shots #3/4 - texturing, ok, BUT you have the same ceiling texture as the walls (it looks that way anyhow). Look through the WAD files, find some textures which are different colourations but match. It's simple changes like this which make the place feel like it has been "constructed" for real, rather than just thrown together in a mapping program. Find textures which look like floors and ceilings. And to liven up the walls, simply add some pillars here and there. Beams/Girders are also good for breaking up "box" rooms!  :smile:
• Try downsizing your main feature buildings - make them different heights, but bring them closer together. This raises potential for walkways and paths between the two! All makes for a good fight!
• A lot of stuff there, but pretty simple and easy to execute, that even the best mappers dont ignore (dont quote me on that :wink: ). Keep at it, read through the tutorials here and on other sites, and please keep mapping and coming for feedback! :smile:

Gwil...thanks a whole bunch for typeing that up for me!  I will defenetly try and keep that in mind in my future maps.  And as for mapping, im not stoping untill im satisfied with my work and that there was nothing that i could do to make my maps better (so, your not going to have to worry about me stopping for a while :smile: ).  This was my first out door map every, and so far i have continued to be amazed by the feedback that i get and how you guys make it sound like its a challange, and not naging me to do my home work.  Thanks again guys, I look forward to the challange!

 Bummer, i just lost a big post....well all im going to say is that this is a new map that stays away from boxes and has original ideas, like a grave yard suspended 40'000 ft up in the air. 

Heres the pics....

First shot: Bottom level, there are 2 more of those style bases on the bottom floor, each in a differnt pattern of being built.

Second shot: Close-up of the graveyard, second floor.

Third shot: Right half of the second floor.  Side of grave diggers hut is shown. 

 Fourth shot: The left half, is brush and some trees.

Fith shot:  The top floor of the level.  Yes i know its bare, but thats how i wanted it.  Its basicly a great place to have a showdown....i have tested this out thouroughly.

Nice triple post!

BTW - what are the r_speeds for these images?  (if you don't know what that is - go into the console and type r_speeds 1 - it's recommended you keep the "wpoly" number below 700.)

R_speeds?  Once again im righting this inbetween classes, so its going to be a while before i can post r_speeds.  But out of curiosity what are they and why do i need to worry about them.  Oh...and one more thing...Is that enough originality for you guys?

R_speeds (short for render speeds, as far as I know) are a display of how fast your map runs. There are various counts, but the most important one is generally seen as w_poly. This is a count of how many world polygons are being rendered, and so are a pretty good indicator of how well the map will run on other peoples computers. You want to keep w_poly as low as possible - below 800 is acceptable by everyone really, sometimes its acceptable to push this up a little in the name of detail though. Different people have different opinions on limits for r_speeds, in time you will no doubt forge your own.

Oh, thanks a lot ReNo.  I understand now.

I tried that r_speed thingy and i cant get it to work, is there another way to check?

It's pretty straightforward.  First, do you have access to the console?  (hit ~ during gameplay and see if anything drops down)  If not, follow these steps:

Create a shortcut to hl.exe.

Right click the shortcut->properties.  Now on the Shortcut tab, set the Target field to C:\Sierra\Half-Life\hl.exe -dev -console (or wherever you have your half-life directory at).

Run the shortcut.  Start up a map.  Hit ~, and then type in "r_speeds 1" (without quotes) and press enter.  Hit ~ again.  A bunch of numbers should be going by at the top left of your screen.  These are your r_speeds.  Pay attention to the wpolys number - this is the one most people care about.

But if you havent got the -dev in the shortcut properties and carnt be arsed to put it in just type developer 1 in the console before you type r_speeds 1 in

gimpinthesink said:
But if you havent got the -dev in the shortcut properties and carnt be arsed to put it in just type developer 1 in the console before you type r_speeds 1 in

you might note, that if the -console itself is not in the shortcut, you cannot access it period.. to enter any commands :biggrin:

No no, i got the console, just that the r_speeds dont come up, it says its working but its not showing its self.  I will play with it a little more.

 

Ok, i got the r_speeds 1 to work, i dont how ever have them for miricle. I do have a question about a map that i recently submitted though. op4_harbor, and op4_abby seem to run choppy if im on the outer fringes of the level looking inward. Is this my r_speeds? There up to about 3000, but i have maps much larger that run like 8000 and it runs nice and smooth, but these do not...Any ideas?

Ronin said:
Ok, i got the r_speeds 1 to work, i dont how ever have them for miricle. I do have a question about a map that i recently submitted though. op4_harbor, and op4_abby seem to run choppy if im on the outer fringes of the level looking inward. Is this my r_speeds? There up to about 3000, but i have maps much larger that run like 8000 and it runs nice and smooth, but these do not...Any ideas?

Ok...for op4_abby my e_poly is about 3000, and my w_poly is about 1000. Could this make the map kinda choppy?

w_poly 1000 could make the map lag a bit, and is generally considered the upper boundary for a map. It's best if you can get the main fighting areas to around 600 and detailed, rarely visited areas below 1000. But there are measures to cut r's in a tutorial here, not sure if it's been put up in the new version.

Thanks a lot sim. I searched for the tut and couldn't find it, so im guessing it hasnt been put up. I am hoping to get these maps up and runing as soon as i can, the lag is really bad for some reason, but i think the extra work is worth it

damnit, this thread is plagued with non-working pix...ERRR

WTF...ALL of the pix are -1bytes?!?!?! ummm ok im confused