Meaningless Violence

mr robot santa....

you sound like a reasonable and sensitive person.

im told that man is the only animal capable of murdering another human for sport. and because of this singularity, peace and love has been in the great quest for intelligent folks since man was ..... made. it recently resurfaced again in prominenece in the late 60's, and was somewhat quieted by time, and satiation of personal wants in the generation that came fom the sixties. i'd be curious to know your age sir, since your arguments hold all the wide eyed passion of the late 60's "love culture" , and have the phrasing of a young boy....thats not meant to be offensive sir, that simply puts the said argument in perspective for me....time changes all.....no exceptions. in small doses, or tidal waves, it will change. just a guess, but i figure at the rate we are going, if we survive, we'll be at peace sometime in the 22nd century.....thats just going with the learning curve.

we are top of the food chain, yet dumber than bricks...."human intelligence" in my mind at times is the most insufferable oxymoron there is. anyway....

i was idealistic at one point in my early life... (the 60's, go figure :smile: ), but time and experience, and repeatitive negative events, have jaded me.....im green with envy, green in my pocket, and green around the gills from being so sick of it all....and a vacation wont fix it.

hold to your beliefs, be true to yourself and your i deals, and eventually, someone will turn a head and say, "hes right".....dont expect overnight success....

but dont give up. ever.

Doc Brasso... :dodgy:

World peace won't happen...

IMO...

well, toasty, to put it mildly, itll be at peace, one way or the other.....by man finally reaching a point of sanity in unison, or about the time the whole f**kin' place blows up....i didnt specify bud :wink:

Doc B.... :dodgy:

I think Ideals are useful as illustrative concepts, and are to be respected given that they form the basis for organized society. However devotion to any single ideal is purest evil. Only ideologues can murder for their beliefs. The pragmatists of the world are the ones who keep the peace.

Even if your ideal is pacifism, you can do incomparable harm. There would have been no necessity for WWII if Hitler had been stomped on by the League of Nations when he first began violating the treaty of Versailles. This would likely have required an act of violence, yet it would have been infinitely preferable to the results of appeasement. There is obveously more historical complexity here than I am acknowledging, but I think the point is valid.

War is frequently justified, and ironicaly, in the best intrests of peace.

---

Some people are like slinkys...

They aren?t really good for anything, but you can't help but laugh when one tumbles down the stairs.

Thank you Dr Brasso,

it seems you are the only one that actually read my posts, at least the
only one who listened. I am 19, and i appreciate your words of
encouragement. i believe humans are getting to the point where they can
actually understand what love is, and this gives me encouragemnet as
well. i will never give up and i will always stand in the light even if
i have to stand there alone. People do listen, and i did come on rather
strong in this thread and i see the errors of that way, it turns people
off rather easily. But i was told by a great man i know that God is
going to wake up eveyone individually, and that day God did prove to me
beyond a shadow of a doubt that he does exist, up till that day i had
always questioned my faith in God, but no longer. He showed me when i
REALLY needed him too and i'm sure he is reaching people every day,
this gives me great hope for the future.

When the time comes, dont get chipped. yep the florida company that
manufactures them has already gotten them FDA approved and you can even
get them implanted in your kids(in the fatty tissue btweeen the deltoid
and the tricep)where it makes you a blip on a screen forever, this same
technology has already been used for years in pets and for wildlife
research and management. :biggrin:

The people behind the scenes nowadays are exactly that, behind the
scenes. The normal view of "rich" is laughable when compared to the
mountain of wealth of a few families at the top. (The Rothschilds and
the Rockafellers) these men are in charge of lending money to nations
or rather in charge of the men in charge of lending money to nations.
Where do u think all the billions and billions of dollars come from?
i'll tell u. they just print it up, its just paper to them, it costs
nothing, or next to nothing anyways to print it. Their key to control
of a nation is to establish a central bank. the central bank in america
is known as the federal reserve, which is a private corporation that is
in charge of our nations economy(ie: the isssuance of money) the US
government only owns 20% of this corporation and is only allowed to
appoint 2 of the 6 members of the federal reserve board. So therfore,
our nation has no real control of its own economy.

It's interesting to note that during the civil war president Lincoln
went to the international banks to ask for a loan, they said ok, 30%
interest. Lincoln refused and instead he decided to print his own
money, which they called greenbacks. The way he got the money into
circulation was he paid the Union soldiers with these greenbacks and
made them good for the payment of taxes(being good for the payment of
taxes was the ONLY reason this was able to succeed as there was nothing
to back the money, no gold no nothing). It was wildly successful, and
Lincoln was assasinated by a hired killer(John Wilkes Booth), who said
he was hired by the international banks. (this is all recorded history
by the way)

president Andrew Jackson spent his whole 2 terms fending off the
central bankers and their politicians. there was an attempt on his
life, luckily both flintlock pistols mis-fired.

Through intense lobying and the infiltration of the government by greed
driven men who would seek to profit from this central banking system,
we now have the federal reserve bank.

Today evry major country has a central banking system and a national
debt, which can only be aquired through a central banking system. And
as a result the citizens of these countries are left to pay off this
debt. So basically we are all already financial slaves, especially if
you are in the credit system. Make no mistake, we are the ones expected
to pay off the debt, and our childen, and their children. These men do
have a plan for the world, and judging by the blanently arrogant words
that spu out of their mouths, it is a grim one.

So theres your history lesson fo the day. dont know what got me started on that but there you go.

Why the new rant?! Anybody who believes in conspiracy theories like this needs to spend more time thinking about it. It's off topic besides.

If I am worried about anything, it's the thought that my labor might one day help to support people who spend more time whining about politics than they do actually contributing something useful to the world. Don't get me wrong, I don't care one bit about "the world". Everyone but me, my friends and family can burn for all I care. I am a greedy bastard out to make money, but that probably means I will end up contributing more to the welfare of mankind than most others who "care" more simply because you have to offer thoughts and achievements of VALUE in order to get rich.

---

Some people are like slinkys...

They aren?t really good for anything, but you can't help but laugh when one tumbles down the stairs.

My economics teacher said that economics should be a compulsory subject. I can see why. Let me clarify the concept of central banking and national debt (this is from memory from over a year ago, so its not perfect, and its from what I know of the Australian system, the US is probably slightly different).

The goal of the central bank of a country is to control that country's economy. Not in a bad way, I can assure you. Central banks set a target interest rate for all loans, which banks approximately follow (plus 1-2%). By doing this, the central bank is able to control inflation. I beleive the US federal reserve has been increasing interest rates lately. This is not to take money from people, this is to control inflation. Without a central bank, a countrys economy will become much less steady. The Great Depression is an example of what happens when economies are not controlled properly.

National debt is, essentially, the total amount of money a country owes others. If you were to take out a loan from a foreign bank, you would contribute to national debt. Most banks are international operations, so most loans you take out come from the country that is best for the bank. So national debt includes not only money the government has borrowed, but the credit card bill Joe Six-pack hasnt paid yet. I know that in late 2004, the Australian government owed no money to other countries, yet Australia had a large national debt.

I also agree with Tracer. Greed is how the system works, and the greedier people are, the better the world's economy will run. As was said in the movie Wall Street, Greed is good.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

exactly, it means they can control infaltion or deflation because they
have control of the flow of money,which means
u take the control of the nations economy away fo the nation. they can
put money in or stop putting money in the economy on a whim of a few
individuals, and no they dont have yours and my best interest in mind,
they have their best intersest in mind, they are about profit, as so
many people here have simply put, they are fueled by greed. we had a
central bank during the great depression, and the people who were "in
the know" sold all of their stock right before it happened ($CHA
CHING!$), and normal
people were o poor they had to sell there buisnesses and all their
assests for pennies on the dollar(to the same people who had sold all
their stock right before the crash). It was a squeeze basically. and
tracer, no u wont contribute to the welfare of mankind as u put, u are
simply fueling a monster. greed is how THIS system works, it has taken
a lot of work and many many years to make it this way, for the precise
reason of gaining control of ours, and every othe nations economy. Its
basically just another step tword globalization, yo.

Globalization

It's going to happen, and I love it. "Greed" as you put it, is the only reason we don't live in grass huts. Hooray for those who are willing to work for personal gain!

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html

<div class="abouttext">Message submitted 1 minutes after original post:</div>
u
wont love it when u have a man in a blue helmet rolling a tank through
your front yard. and "greed" is the reason u live in a house and most
people in this world harldy have a grass hut to live in.

Until we all have ONE CURRENCY globalization just leeches off the strongest nations. We'll never have one currency...

Don't get the implant chip. It's the mark of the Beast. Plus, who wants to be TRACKED everywhere they go?

Robo-

Greed is why those people live in grass huts or less.

• africa: warlords have all the money, everyone else just has aids
• Middle east: elite families have the money, everyone else has suicide bombs.
• pacific islands: corporations have money, ppl just have a grass hut
• South america: Corporations have everything, poor Indians have nothing but stripped off rain forest.
• USA: everyone has a lt of crap and complains about it.

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

"Globalization" is not a law, or a conspiracy. Nobody conceived of the concept, gave it a name, or pushed it until it was already happening. I do not believe there is a sinister will behind it anymore than I consider rain the result of some sort of malicious plot to spoil my vacations.

Yes, Nickel you're right. Globalization does put strain on developed economies, but I don't think that is necessarily the same as "leeching" them. A nation, just like any organism must evolve under stress. Our economy has been adapting over the past fifty years, and will continue to do so. Manufacturing in America is dying, and there is nothing wrong with that! We are becoming a country that exports intellect rather than steel. It IS a painful process but in the end I think it will be more positive than negative.

Let me also make a distinction among types of greed. The "greed" of a capitalist is not that of a thief, and vis-versa. The use of force to extract wealth from people or country is entirely different from offering a product for sale. Money is pure human effort, intellect, and creativity, distilled into a form we can trade. I exchange my effort and thoughts for that of others every time I walk into a store or flip on a light switch. The farther I extend my personal exertions, the more valuable they become to other people, and the richer I become.

A thief confiscates the effort of others without recompense. To TAKE money is not to MAKE money. In taking this action, the thief destroys the meaning and value of that which he seeks to seize. I mean that literally. When the balance Takers and Makers reaches a certain point, an economy will collapse. That is why America is the richest country in the world, and places like Africa and the Middle East are the poorest. We are (or were) an nation of Makers, while they are countries ruled by Takers. This sounds very abstract, but the concept money itself is no less so. No doubt all of us fill our stomaches through these abstractions every day.

---

Some people are like slinkys...

They aren?t really good for anything, but you can't help but laugh when one tumbles down the stairs.

Robot Santa, do you know why everyone sold their stock at the beginning of the Great Depression? Its because values were falling. The values started falling rapidly, all the traders decided they should sell before it goes any lower, more shares on the market causes their value to fall even more. At the time, the economic policy of most governments was the opposite of what it is today. Back then, governments would put taxes up and cut public spending in that situation, which makes the depression worse (they didnt know at the time, of course). Since then, Keynesian economic theory has been used and is successful. There would have been at least one major economic depression since then if not for governments and central banks controlling inflation. Also, you may not beleive this, but what is in the best interests of the central banks is in fact in the long-term best interests of the people in their country. It must sound bizarre, that a powerful institution like the Federal Reserve doesnt want to break into your house and drink the blood of your pets, but its true.

You dont seem to understand that what is in the best interests of those in power often is in your best interests as well.

I agree with Tracer.

What is wrong with your location being tracked, anyway?

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

It's about freedom people. We live in what is supposed to be a free country and every day
(nowadays) our freedom is under assault (ie: the patriot act, the
victory act and several others) these are thousands and thousands of
pages of legislation desined to strip u and me of our civil liberties,
our god given right to be free. In my city (Austin, Texas) we have
passed a resolution AGAINST this completley unconstitutional bill
thanks to CITIZENS of our city that were involved in the Save the Bill
of Rights Campaign. Hundreds of towns and cities and states have passed
the same or similar resolutions. Our country as we know it is going to
come to an end if we dont educate ourselves and do something about
this. All across the nation the military is training with our police
departments and SWAT units, to take your guns and "keep you safe". The
military doesn't want this in the public eye and in some cases the
military training that is going on in small towns across the nation
has been stopped because the public has become aware and decided to do
something about it, protest. We still have that right for now in most
situations unless the mayor decides to declare a "national emergency"
in which case peaceful demonstraters (and in many cases buisness owners
and patrons, oh and old ladies) are gassed, pepper sprayed, beaten,
arrested, held at FEMA camps and charged fines to peacefully assemble
and protest. Under the USA patriot act if Martial law (a red alert, u
know the terror alert scale on the news) is declared control of the
country is turned over to FEMA (federal emergency managment agency) and
NORTHCOM (the military), if u are outside your house after curfew u are
considered an enemy combatant. And the defenition of an enemy combatant
or "terrorist" is anyone endangering human life that is in violation of
federal or state law. Thats right, americans are to be considered enemy
combatants, targets.

This IS the land of the free, and if you give up your freedom you diserve the tyranny u will undoubtedly recieve.

http://www.slate.com/id/2087984/

[url]http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c107:1:.temp~c107J4AnBE:: [/url] there it is in black and white, read section 802(A)

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d107:h.r.03162:

Yes, i also believe, nickel, that the chip is the mark of the beast.
The "human bar code". It wont just have you as a blip on the radar, it
will have your medical information, your criminal history, your
financial status and may eventually replace paper money. In some places
you can already voluntarily get a microchip implanted in your hand that
contains your credit information and pay for things by simply swiping
your hand. In some HEB's around the country you can already pay for
your groceries by scanning your thumb. In many products you buy in your
local target and Wal Mart (at least here in Texas, soon to be in your
respective states) there are RFID tracking devices. It's interesting,
on my 18th birthday i received a razor in the mail from Gillette. I
never purchased a gillette product before in my life, never gave them
any personal information or anything. These companies admittedly make
profiles on people and use them to spam you with junk mail. In the case
of some products, its set up to where the store cameras take a picture
of you when u pick the item up and then another when u check out, all
to make sure u paid for it, to increase profits and to alter marketing
strategy. But these stores dont even feel obligated to let their
customers know that they are being tracked.

http://www.rfidjournal.com/faq/16/49

http://www.spychips.com/

just google RFID

They put these things in clothes, cars, all kinds of things.

BTW the RFID chips intended for use in humans are know as the VeriChip about the size of a grain of rice.

http://www.verichipcorp.com/

http://www.mercola.com/2003/dec/6/verichip.htm#

http://www.mercola.com/2002/mar/13/computer_chip.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verichip

Does this sound like the land of the free and the home of the brave to
you? To me it sounds like the land of the tracked and the home of the
databased. And yet, most people dont even know about it.

The de-industrialization of this country is NOT a good thing. Aside from taking jobs away from americans, did you
know that clinton signed and executive order to give our only (1 of
only 3) deep sea ports on the Pacific side of the country directly to
the Chinese so that they can directly ship slave made products into the
country and sell them in the 1 million square feet of strip mall they
built right next to the port, for even cheaper than u can buy them at
wal-mart. they are effectivley cutting out the middle-man
(retail stores). It's interesting to know that deep sea ports are of
strategic military importance, and OUR PRESIDENT JUST HANDED IT OVER TO
THE COMMUNIST CHINESE!!!???(oops i mean "capitalist"....rrrrriiiiiiiiigggghhhhhhttttt.) ARE U READING THIS!? we start and fund
covert wars all over the world, and have been for decades to fight and
prevent the spread of communism. We have fought 2 public wars in which
81,020 americans died and 256,587 more were wounded to PREVENT the
spread of communism! THIS IS OUTRAGEOUS!!! These men must be rolling
over in their graves! and while the chinese do pay their "workers" less
than 50 cents (i think it's somehere around 20 cents actaully) an hour
for their work, im am pretty dang sure that they are forced to work
there, this is actually going to be my next area of research, i have
heard that a chinese man has made a documentary on the slave labor used
in china and intend to find it and watch it.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/1/10/200712.shtml

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/jan2003/chin-j31.shtml

http://www.willthomas.net/Convergence/Weekly/China.htm

Our country is being sold out and our constitution is being ripped to
shreds(actaully it already has since congress passed patriot act 1 and
its only gotten worse with the passage of more "anti-terror"
legislation, and we are now defacto living in what is called a "police
state", the completion of which will happen when martial law is
declared because of a "terrorist threat" and when they come to take
everyones guns).

And when this happens, if it happens, if it isn't stopped first by the
awakened american public, there will im sad to say be physical
resistance to this. That is why it is so important to get educated and
to help others get educated and stop tyranny from engulfing our nation.

"Those who would give up liberty to attain saftey, deserve neither liberty nor saftey." -Benjamin Franklin

Wil5on, power corrupts. What is in the best interest of those in power
is gaining more power, what is in yours and my best intersest is to
limit their power, so we can be free.

Nickel-

true.

however, the gap between rich and poor in the USA is getting bigger and bigger, soon enough we wont have a middle class anymore.

and dont forget that africa also has millions of sterilized women thanks to the love and care of the UN and DynCorp.

Wil5on-

The economic system in use during the time of the great depression was
around and being used for literally hundreds of years prior to the
depression, so yes they did know how it worked at the time, like i said
it was a squeeze for the seizure of property. There was also 2 smaller
depressions around that time, one a little earlier and one a little
later, in the early 30's if im not mistaken, so the claim of ignorance
of how the system works is pretty unconvincing. Also if i remeber
correctly there was a time in the late 19th century where there was no
central bank of the nation but rather each state had its own sort of
central bank and still used the fractional reserve banking system.
While this system is still easily corupted, it would only be on a state
wide level as opposed to nation wide (and by nation wide i dont mean
corrupted by the leaders of the nation i mean by the people who own the
bank that control the economy of the nation). During this period our
economy was very strong. And i wouldnt put it past them to drink your
pets blood, or at least burn a piniata shaped like your pet in effigy.

http://www.barefootsworld.net/usfraud.html thers a good site that looks
like it has a boat load of info on this, wow this is long.

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>We still have that right for now in most situations unless the mayor decides to declare a "national emergency" in which case peaceful demonstraters (and in many cases buisness owners and patrons, oh and old ladies) are gassed, pepper sprayed, beaten, arrested, held at FEMA camps and charged fines to peacefully assemble and protest. Under the USA patriot act if Martial law (a red alert, u know the terror alert scale on the news) is declared control of the country is turned over to FEMA (federal emergency managment agency) and NORTHCOM (the military), if u are outside your house after curfew u are considered an enemy combatant.</DIV></DIV>

National emergencies, and martial law, arent declared just because some politician feels like opressing their people. Think about why these are declared, and why it makes sense to imprison people who are blocking the police and military (who beleive it or not, are there to help you) when theres a flood, hurricane, earthquake, volcanic eruption, terrorist attack, or any number of other disasters.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>And the defenition of an enemy combatant or "terrorist" is anyone endangering human life that is in violation of federal or state law. Thats right, americans are to be considered enemy combatants, targets.</DIV></DIV>

Yes, God forbid we send the police out to catch people who are violating the law and endangering lives.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>The "human bar code". It wont just have you as a blip on the radar, it will have your medical information, your criminal history, your financial status and may eventually replace paper money. In some places you can already voluntarily get a microchip implanted in your hand that contains your credit information and pay for things by simply swiping your hand. In some HEB's around the country you can already pay for your groceries by scanning your thumb. In many products you buy in your local target and Wal Mart (at least here in Texas, soon to be in your respective states) there are RFID tracking devices. It's interesting, on my 18th birthday i received a razor in the mail from Gillette. I never purchased a gillette product before in my life, never gave them any personal information or anything. These companies admittedly make profiles on people and use them to spam you with junk mail. In the case of some products, its set up to where the store cameras take a picture of you when u pick the item up and then another when u check out, all to make sure u paid for it, to increase profits and to alter marketing strategy. But these stores dont even feel obligated to let their customers know that they are being tracked.</DIV></DIV>

This sounds quite convenient to me. I'd rather just run my thumb over a reader than have to deal with piles of coins. If I had a medical condition, I'd like to know that a paramedic could just scan my thumb and know what was wrong. Junk mail doesnt bother me, since it can be ignored. If you dont want the razor, throw it away. It's also within a stores rights to take photos of people in the store, the "security cameras are in use here" signs are a courtesy and a theft deterrent. If you dont want your photo taken, close your windows and stay inside.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>The de-industrialization of this country is NOT a good thing. Aside from taking jobs away from americans, did you know that clinton signed and executive order to give our only (1 of only 3) deep sea ports on the Pacific side of the country directly to the Chinese so that they can directly ship slave made products into the country and sell them in the 1 million square feet of strip mall they built right next to the port, for even cheaper than u can buy them at wal-mart. they are effectivley cutting out the middle-man (retail stores). It's interesting to know that deep sea ports are of strategic military importance, and OUR PRESIDENT JUST HANDED IT OVER TO THE COMMUNIST CHINESE!!!??? ARE U READING THIS!? we start and fund covert wars all over the world, and have been for decades to fight and prevent the spread of communism. We have fought 2 public wars in which 81,020 americans died and 256,587 more were wounded to PREVENT the spread of communism! THIS IS OUTRAGEOUS!!! These men must be rolling over in their graves! and while the chinese do pay their "workers" less than 50 cents (i think it's somehere around 20 cents actaully) an hour for their work, im am pretty dang sure that they are forced to work there, this is actually going to be my next area of research, i have heard that a chinese man has made a documentary on the slave labor used in china and intend to find it and watch it.</DIV></DIV>

You have a lot to learn about international relations I think. Trade is very important, especially with a country like China. China, since around the late 1980s, has undergone almost constant economic growth, as their government moves towards a capitalist system. This means theres a billion Chinese consumers starting to come into the world market for consumer goods. Its as much a help for US businesses (eg. car manufacturers) being able to sell to China's elite as it is for Chinese businesses being able to sell their cheap goods in the US. You may also be interested to find that things are much cheaper in China than the US. I know from talking to my filthy red communist chinese friends, even in the big cities, you can get a good meal for less than a dollar. 20 cents an hour may not seem like much, but its much more than these people could make outside the factories.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Wil5on, power corrupts. What is in the best interest of those in power is gaining more power, what is in yours and my best intersest is to limit their power, so we can be free.</DIV></DIV>

What is in the best interest of those in power is gaining more power. How do they gain more power? For politicians, they do this by getting more votes. If they do something against the will of the majority of the people, they lose votes, and lose power. If the government passes a bill tomorrow turning the US into a Combine-like police state, that government would have no chance of remaining in power after the next election. Either by the democratic process, or an armed rebellion, that government would lose its power. Hence, the government would avoid such an extreme measure. The system, over a long timeframe, is self-stabilising.

And on what you added while I was typing all this, I think you should research the name John Maynard Keynes. He is largely responsible for current economic thinking. I'd explain but I'm tired, but heres an article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Maynard_Keynes

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

Thomas Jefferson once said:

"I believe that banking institutions are more
dangerous to our liberties than standing armies . . . If the American
people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency,
first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that
will grow up around [the banks] . . . will deprive the people of all
property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their
fathers conquered . . . The issuing power should be taken from the
banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs." -- Thomas Jefferson -- The Debate Over The Recharter Of The Bank Bill, (1809)

<div class="abouttext">Message submitted 3 minutes after original post:

</div>Wil5on-

i think sir u are the first person i have ever talked to who seems to
actually WANT every aspect of your life to be controlled by someone
else.

and section 802(A) the defenition of an enemy combatant or "terrorist" is anyone
endangering human life that is in violation of federal or state law.
Thats right, americans are to be considered enemy combatants, targets.

i actually made a small error, its the defenition of a domestic
terrorist. it means u CAN be considered a terrorist for violation of ANY
law, i repeat ANY law, and u can be shot for it. i mean standing in the
middle of the road is against the law right, and endangers the person
standing in the roads life, and peoples lives who are driving on that
road right? so why shouldn't the person standing in the road be
considered a terrorist and an enemy combatant? that makes perfect sense! i mean just go ahead and shoot the idiot, right?

As for the protest thing, i think u should see this, as well as every one should see it, although i can already foresee flamage.

http://www.archive.org/download/PoliceStateII/AlexJonesPoliceStateIIThetakeover1of2.ram

http://www.archive.org/download/PoliceStateII/AlexJonesPoliceStateIIThetakeover2of2.ram

or streaming

http://www.archive.org/stream/PoliceStateII/AlexJonesPoliceStateIIThetakeover1of2.ram

http://www.archive.org/stream/PoliceStateII/AlexJonesPoliceStateIIThetakeover2of2.ram

the man who made this documentary presents it in an over-the-top
fashion according to most people but just try and pay attention to the
info.

sigh

Though you have the right to debat endlessly on this topic, I grow so
very tired of people that go on and on about one topic and for some
reason seem to want to convince the other that they are right. Just
accept the fact that there will be always someone who disagrees with
you. Part of the game in life is to play along.

I'm not saying that you should dig your head in the sand, but face it,
what can you change about the way the world is? Would you buy yourself
a gun a shoot down every 'terrorist' you see? I tell you this, that
will take you a while. Plus, you can now everything about one subject,
but if you do not se that knowledge, what benefit do you get from it? A
good party talk?

As I've said before, it's fine to talk. But life goes on, I say don't miss it.

(PS. Nickel, you a christian? you knowledge of the Bibel is quite good)

i think sir u are the first person i have ever talked to who seems to actually WANT every aspect of your life to be controlled by someone else.

I don't, I just dont have any illusions about people trying to control my life. Noone is going to, legally, barge into my house, hold a gun to my head and force me to do anything. I have no conspiracy theories, I know noone is out to get me. I'd rather live like this, as a part of the system, than try and take down the system, since I'd be worse off if the system failed.

i actually made a small error, its the defenition of a domestic terrorist. it means u CAN be considered a terrorist for violation of ANY law, i repeat ANY law, and u can be shot for it. i mean standing in the middle of the road is against the law right, and endangers the person standing in the roads life, and peoples lives who are driving on that road right? so why shouldn't the person standing in the road be considered a terrorist and an enemy combatant? that makes perfect sense! i mean just go ahead and shoot the idiot, right?

If the guy is determined to kill someone, and there is no alternative to shooting him, then yes, it is justified. If its just some random guy standing in the road, if the police shout at him, he'll probably move. If not, they can go out there and grab him. It sounds reasonable to me that someone who is endangering lives should be considered a "terrorist".

Paladin, yes, Nickel is very Christian.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting wil5on</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>What is wrong with your location being tracked, anyway?</DIV></DIV>

Man, it's bad enough any old jagoff can locate me with my cell phone. But when I wanna go out in the woodsand I leave all tracking crap behind, I don't want to have ANY outside influence on my. And having people know EXACTLY where on the globe I am would suck all balls.

You've seen the shows where they track people down with GPS locators (1337 TrAX0rz). I wanna be able to get lost once in a while and I want to be able to have people lose me. There is not a place on earth where GPS can't find you...

/me hates GPS

Paladin: Yes I'm a Christian. :smile: Are you?

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

I heard about a new rice recipe yesterday.

---

There is no history until something happens, then there is.

Best thing for rice is this;

Hokay, cook Teriyaki Chicken with like.. s**t loads of Teriyaki.

Then you put rice with peas on it.

Best eva!

Dude.. those little packets that come with Ramen Noodles make a good base for some good stir fry.

Of course.. WITH RICE!

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

Nickelplate said:
Dude.. those little packets that come with Ramen Noodles make a good base for some good stir fry.

Of course.. WITH RICE!

Dude. If you can find a "Big Lots" go to the spice section and look for the chicken bullion. Its most excellent.

---

There is no history until something happens, then there is.

Best thing for rice is this;

Hokay, cook Teriyaki Chicken with like.. s**t loads of Teriyaki.

Then you put rice with peas on it.

Best eva!

Nah, steamed rice, barbequed chicken with a crisp side with skin, good heap of teriyaki sauce and fresh cold beansprouts.

<a name="1">13:1</a>
And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up
out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns
ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

<a name="2">13:2</a>
And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his
feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion:
and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

<a name="3">13:3</a>
And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and
his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the
beast.

<a name="4">13:4</a>
And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the
beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the
beast? who is able to make war with him?

<a name="5">13:5</a>
And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things
and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two
months.

<a name="6">13:6</a>
And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

<a name="7">13:7</a>
And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to
overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues,
and nations.

<a name="8">13:8</a>
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose
names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the
foundation of the world.

<a name="9">13:9</a>
If any man have an ear, let him hear.

<a name="10">13:10</a>
He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he
that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the
patience and the faith of the saints.

<a name="11">13:11</a>
And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

<a name="12">13:12</a>
And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before
him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the
first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

<a name="13">13:13</a>
And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

<a name="14">13:14</a>
And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of
those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast;
saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image
to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

<a name="15">13:15</a>
And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast,
that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many
as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

<a name="16">13:16</a>
And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free
and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

<a name="17">13:17</a>
And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

<a name="18">13:18</a>
Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the
number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is
Six hundred threescore and six.

Got a Big Lots here in West Plains!

Dude, If you ever get a chance... go to my balls and get the salt off them!~!

Okay, Robot Santa: stop with the Revelations... This sort of stuff is what makes everyone think that all us Christians are Wacko!!

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

Nickel: I sure am :smile: Good to know that there are Christians on other places of the internet.

Paladin[NL said:
]Nickel: I sure am :smile: Good to know that there are Christians on other places of the internet.

YEah, I seem to bring the Christians out of the woodwork wherever I go. Mostly becau seI am so outspoken about it and the others are like "Hey, it;s okay, we're not gonna be persecuted!" lol

I catch some grief about it sometimes but its no big deal, kinda funny actually.

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

Well, I guess there's nothing wrong with being outspoken :smile: I'm not the
usual guy who throws around with Biblical verses, though they often
come in very good. But then again, how are you gonna use the Bible when
your posting a critic on a map :razz:

Ok, back on topic, I still think we've said enough about terrorism. I
want to say one last thing. If you've read Revelations, the last book
of the Bible, you will see, like I do, that things are aproaching it's
end.

the pope was called, and still has the name inscribed on his pointy hat, VICARIUS FILII DEI (representative of God's son). if you add the values of the roman numerals in the name, you get 666 (VICARIVS FILII DEI).

OH NO!!!

anyways, (haha, cringe at my bad grammar, nick)

the human race has climbed/been pushed[delete as applicable] to the top of the evolutionary tree, got fat on the fruit there, and is now about to fall off, taking a few of the other branches with it.

world peace can only come about with world domination. yogoslavia was at peace when the russians occupied it during the cold war, but as soon as they left, ww2 resumed. is this a suitable world peace?

---

i eat paint

Meh, think about all the natural disasters. tsunamis, hurricanes. The USA and Muslims in particular have been very naughty! I'm afraid they will be smote soon enough.

Methinks things really are coming to an end. But i wanna finish my hotrod first. I am ALMOST ready to put the engine in!!

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

I find the way you Christians seem to think the end of the world is upon us, to be honest, quite amusing. Not that I mean to offend you, but the end of the world has been predicted so many times in the past and passed by uneventfully (eg. the year 2000, for a good long list see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_unfulfilled_Christian_Prophecy).

While looking for that list, I also stumbled upon Islamic eschatology. It sounds much nicer than the Christian version, I must say. From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_eschatology :

At the time appointed by Allah, Isa [Jesus] will physically return to this world, end all wars, and usher in an era of peace.

Muslims believe that Allah knows best who will enter Heaven and that some people of the other Abrahamic faiths (regarded as "People of the book") will also get into heaven.

The Muslims who will not inherit heaven will be punished with a temporary stay in Jahannam (Hell), and will go to heaven later as long as there is "one atom of faith in their hearts," as stated by the Islamic prophet Muhammad.

Much more pleasant than Christianity, with its eternal damnation and such.

Other religions have their own theories on the end of the world. Judaism has 2240 AD as the date. Buddhism originally predicted the end of the world 500 years after the time of Buddha, but that was later extended to 5000 years. The Mayan religion predicts the end of the world in the year 2012. The full article is at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

Bu then again, what live do you have as a Muslim on this earth? Praying
five times a day and still not knowing wether you will be save or not.
I'm just so glad that I know for sure that I'm going to heaven.

But have you read what they prophecied (on that wiki)? I think, from
reading what they prophecied, that they where false teachers, seeing
that they prophecied about things of which the Bible clearly says that
only the Father knows the time in which Christ will return. The Bible
doesn't state a specific date on which the events that are written in
Revelations will occur, only in the book Dani?l is spoken of how long
the first and the Great Tribulation will last (2 times 3,5 years).

So understandably you think that most beliefs are untrue, because they
all claim to know the date or year at which the world as we know it
will come to an end. Yet the Bible doesn't speak of a certain date/year
etc. only that the Father knows when it will happen. Plus, I don't
'preach' hell and damnation, the Lord is calling everyone to come, I'm
just hoping that I'll see you there.

(Nickel about your car: (Pr 1:2 "
2 Vanity of vanities, saith the Preacher, vanity of vanities; all [is] vanity." :biggrin: )

I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'm not accusing you of preaching, I'm just saying its strange to always be thinking that the end is coming. By now enough predictions of the end of the world have come and gone to make it clear, at the very least, that its nearly impossible to predict (and as you say, it is impossible to prophecise, and in fact, its wrong to speculate about it). If I were a Christian, I'd not worry about it and take a more passive approach. Its easier to plan for the future without taking an apocalypse into account, and something like that is impossible to take into account anyway.

Also, according to the Muslim faith, you are saved from hell after a time if you have any faith at all. Which I find is much more lenient than the Christian idea (a stay in hell is eternal). It is also possible to get into the Muslim heaven without actually being Muslim.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

if people constantly live in the shadow of a coming apocalypse, they're more likely to live a good, moral life. i mean.. if the day of reckoning were tomorrow, would you be crossing through the pearly gates? probably not. but you'd be passing out sandwiches to the homeless and helping old ladies across the street all f**kin day, eh? if i were god, i'd make it more like a pop quiz.. keep the world in the dark about it so when it comes, people get caught with their pants down..!! muahaha! (literally, in some cases.)

i, personally, think these organized religions are a load of crap. however, the morals and general ways of life are something to be recognized and admired. can't say i've read much into islam, but the 10 commandments and the majority of the fables of the bible are a good baseline for any civilized society. and the best way to ensure people stay anywhere near this baseline.. is the ever-present "your day of reckoning will come". but yea, i'm on the verge of rambling... back to work.

I'm not living in fear of the apocalypse...I don't even call it an
apocalypse because the Congregation/Church is in Heaven by the time God
cleanses the earth for the reign of His Son. For me it's more looking
forward to coming home.

I agree with Bewbies on the organized religion thingy. At least to the
degree where human interferance changes the way a religion is
performed. Look at the Cathelic church. Lots of idols and false
gods(the so-called saints they worship). A single figure that rules and
decides the course the church is taking(or not taking). If you take the
Cathelic church as the way that Christian religion is mend, then you're
very wrong. All the things the Cathelic church stands for is not found
in the Bible(read the letters Paul wrote to various churches and notice
he writes about rules that are from men etc etc)

To Wil5on: I find a loving God that sends his only Son to earth to die
for our sins, and thus giving the opportunity to freely come to Him,
more appealing then the fear of not knowing if you'll get in heaven.

I find the idea that as long as youre basically a good person, no matter what religion you follow, the worst you get is a temporary stay in Hell, and that all people will eventually get into Heaven.

I'm just an outside observer really, I'm an atheist, and I find the idea that there is no heaven or hell more appealing than either.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

the idea that there's nothing but oblivion after death not only scares the s**t outa me, but isn't something we can easily comprehend. i mean.. nothingness? no higher power? we're born, then die.. and that's it? this is a terrible idea and, again, not something easy to comprehend or even accept thereafter. i think this is the biggest hurdle atheists have to jump.. which leads me to believe that even most atheists are a WEE bit agnostic.

I just believe in treating others as I'd like to be treated. Other than
that I objectively look at all religions and just keep some of the
ideologies in mind. I've tried being Christian, but I just can't do it.
Too many contradictions for me. I'm just not a believer type.

The idea of not existing is impossible for the human mind to comprehend. I know this. It doesnt worry me. This idea, to me, simply makes sense, and I'd rather think that this really is all that there is, rather than a test which decides what happens to me for eternity.

Most atheists are agnostic, I know this. I'm not.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

What ever floats your boat, I guess. Won't think any less of you :smile:

wil5on said:
I find the idea that as long as youre basically a good person, no matter what religion you follow, the worst you get is a temporary stay in Hell, and that all people will eventually get into Heaven.

HAHA! like a time-out in the corner to think about what you've done!

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

You saw that too? :razz:

Yeah. lol

Outside of this world there is no time "1000 years is as a day and a day is as 1000 years."

In truth, eternity is not only ALL the time, but it is the absence of time. so there really cant be anything "temporary" in eternity because one minute is the same as ALL eternity which is forever. so complicated to explain...

Sorry, it's not just gonna be a slap on the wrist.

BTW, Catholics don't worship the saints, they ask them to pray for them, because they are in higher standing with god because they were so pious. see?

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

Interesting post there Nickel. Deep.

You say "its not just gonna be a slap on the wrist" like going to hell forever is a reasonable punishment. But since no sin is greater than another sin in the eyes of God, people are condemned to an existence solely of pain for the smallest of sins. Even if they didnt know they were committing them. Such as the billions of people who have lived and died without even hearing about the existence of this man called "Jesus".

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

Yeah. lol
Outside of this world there is no time "1000 years is as a day and a day is as 1000 years."

In truth, eternity is not only ALL the time, but it is the absence
of time. so there really cant be anything "temporary" in eternity
because one minute is the same as ALL eternity which is forever. so
complicated to explain...

Sorry, it's not just gonna be a slap on the wrist.

BTW, Catholics don't worship the saints, they ask them to pray for
them, because they are in higher standing with god because they were so
pious. see?

Ok even then their wrong, simply because every one who has taken Christ
as their Salvation can come freely before the throne and everyone is
equal in God's eyes

Paladin:

"For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus" (1 Tim. 2:5). Tells us that they are, indeed wrong.

"First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way. This is good, and pleasing to God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth" (1 Tim. 2:1?4). Tells us that praying for others and asking others to pray for you is not bad.

Wil5on:

I'll quote something I've said before that applies:

In the bible, Abraham was told that God was going to give him a son and that the son would become a great nation. Abraham got tired of waiting for God, so he and his wife Sarah, took things into thier own hands and decided that Abraham should impregnate Hagar, Sarah's maidservant. Her son was Ishmael. Then a bit later, Sarah also became pregnant and had Isaac, whose descendants are the tribes of Israel.

God also said he would turn Ishmael into a great nation. Ishmael's descendants are the people who we now refer to as "Muslims." Pretty much everyone ranging from Iraq down to Saudi Arabia.

Because of Abraham's sin of adultery with Hagar, People even now are suffering because of these people who are the direct result of his sin. I wanted to write this to explain that this is why bad things happen to good people. Because God gave Abraham free will, and by his free will he chose something that resulted in bad things happening to good people. If God took away the consequences of Abraham's actions, then he may as well have not had free will to begin with. This is the answer to the question I'm SO sick of hearing: "Why does such a loving god let bad things happen to good people?"

It's not only because of thier sins, It's because of the sins of others. Just like we are ALL paying for abraham's sin because now we have to deal with these muslim Extremists. Also, this is the reason why Christians try to SPREAD the gospel... Not to piss ppl off or to get more money (stuff i've heard, really) They do it because they don't like ppl going to hell, and they want them to go to heaven and be nice ppl and stuff. see? The decisions you make will not only affect you, but your children too. and thier children and so on. Because if god takes away the consequences of your actions, then did you really have free will to begin with?

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

Interesting arguments Nickel, but all ones I've heard before.

Is there any mention in the Bible of other groups with no relation to Abraham? For example, native Americans, native Australians, native Chinese, in fact the native people of almost any area outside the middle east, europe and northern africa. None of these people were descended from Abraham, in fact, many were not even aware of Christianity until after the 15th century AD.

It fascinates me that your sense of justice says it is right to punish someone for something beyond their control.

---

"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

Where all children of Adam and Eva, so we inherently are all sinners through Adam and Eve

you'd think natural selection woulda weeded out 'sin' by now. what a shame.