reddawn Campaign Screenshot

This shot was taken from an early part of the second level. You're in an abandon area which used to be a storm water drain check point. There's a big storm on outside and as a result, the normally empty canals are wet and soggy with water. This area used to be used up until 2040 where it was abandon. It now sits below massive constructs which the people of Heaxam city call home.

Earth's Single governing force has swept the area recently but has failed in there attempts to contain the virus outbreak. At this point in the game, Hexam is the only infected area for reasons unknown. The dead soldiers make a great source of ammo and health. But you have to move quickly through this area and continue to the top of the city. Who knows what enemies you will face near the canals.

So this is the first campaign screenshot ever released on the interwebs. I was hoping you guys could comment on the shot or the intro. Just remember reddawn is a mod for the goldsource engine. Here are some more shots:

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Aaron's Stuff

I like the shot, but come on aaron, the general banter boards are not the place for posting screenshots of maps. I know its a mod, so you might be trying to get past on that technicality, but until you're doing a release/beta advert type post, keep it in the mapping forum please mate. The way you've setup this post makes me fear for a new thread like this popping up every week... I would strongly advise against that :razz:

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[img]http://card.mygamercard.net/sig/Default/reno84.png[/img]
Designer @ Haiku Interactive | ReNo-vation.net

Sorry reno. I thought about putting this in the mapping boards but would I have to create a new profile for these screenshots. And can you create a poll in the mapping threads?

Feel free to move it.

edit: There will be no screen shot every week, month or year.

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Aaron's Stuff

Well, that's a shame, as I think you should release media to get people interested, but probably in a more scheduled, batched approach. I see you've uploaded a few other shots now though, which is better than just posting one picture like you had done.

I guess using the Snarkpit's map system isn't exactly ideal for releasing mod media, unfortunately. Not really sure if this is the best alternative though... I wouldn't worry about making it a poll by the way, just ask for feedback - I'm sure people will say if they are impressed or otherwise whether you want them to or not :wink:

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[img]http://card.mygamercard.net/sig/Default/reno84.png[/img]
Designer @ Haiku Interactive | ReNo-vation.net

I actually like them.

Wasn't there a chapter system in the mapping forum, so that you could release media and updates for a map in chapters, in one and the same thread? Might be useful in this case.

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What the Snarkpitters listen to!

Thanks guys :wink: . Do we have any other comments?

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Aaron's Stuff

So I've got to ask: Why doesn't it look like a storm water sewer ... at all? Considering some of the amazing architectural achievements gained in this area, I'm surprised you would have such an advanced civilization (there's one government, right?) have such non-functional sewers.

Why is there like ... human stuff in it? Even if the thing is "abandoned" it would still collect storm water. (Maybe look up how these things work?)

Might I suggest taking some notes from current technology? For instance, the (as far as I know) most advanced storm sewer in Japan.

As far as gameplay goes you could easily have some amazing dark atmosphere with unknown enemies ahead (zombies? awesome). There's also, if done correctly, the effect of chasmophilia (I think that's the term ... that's what google says, in any case) which is, pretty much, the opposite of claustrophobia.

You could also have it to where, you need to do stuff in a timely manner because storm water is collecting in the reservoir shutting you out to areas you were in previously, while there's an ever encroaching need to get out of the facility for fear of the enemies there, but also the water that is collecting in the structure.

It may help you to think about areas of the game more along the lines of gameplay rather than plot, the best games ever made had plot and story that was initially grafted onto the gameplay. (The Legend of Zelda and Half-Life are a couple of games that were crafted this way)

It would allow you to design the entire game then work your story to suit your gameplay. Of course, having an overall idea of what you want to happen is not bad (and can help keep continuity). But what you're showing here so far, (I understand it's one map) is rather mediocre looking as far as gameplay goes. I played HL1 and both of it's add-ons like 8 years ago ... there have been large advancements in gameplay and that's something you should keep in mind (especially because it has nothing to do with technology, but rather level design)

Anyway, good luck and all that jazz.

Oh one more thing. If the game doesn't have zombies in it (like motherf**king dawn of the dead zombies) ... I will be disappointed. Post apocalyptic futures just don't work without some sort of "zombiesque" aspect.

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Blame it on Microsoft, God does.

Thanks crono I found it interesting, really I did thanks. Well zombies are in reddawn, and yes the area that I showed you doesn't really hint water at all.

Anyways I think the gameplay in this level is awesome. At this point in the game the only weapons you have is a crowbar and a shotgun. There are 3 agrunts around the place holder create arena, while you kill those, two zombies (with different skins) hear the fight at which point they come. I played this encounter over and over and so did my brother. It was really fun on hard and hard only. You have to than press a switch, go back to the where the first shot was taken and the garage door thingy opens. You run into a trigger which than a vent breaks above you and a headcrab falls down, then a second later a zombie appears from around the corner and comes to get you.

Both the zombies and agrunt have been teweked to make them better. The shot gun has also been tweaked. Makes for some sweet gameplay.

As for the water building up. There wont be any of those in reddawn. There are a few doors, inaccessible areas which are gated off and drainage pipe which all would allow the water to flow out of the area. The kind of water rising puzzels are unrealistic, you just happen to be there when the water rises, that and the fact of all the area where the water can escape.

Anyways this part of the game is being worked on at the moment and I will release a beta reddawn version soon (hopefully by the end of 07) which will contain the whole seacond level in its finished state at the time and the full game engine at the time.

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Aaron's Stuff

Honestly, the gameplay you just described sounds lame. Sorry.

Continue to do whatever you want to. I'm sure you're making this more because you want to rather than if other people want to play it (which is fine).

Good luck.

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Blame it on Microsoft, God does.

Actually people who have playin the mod are surprisingly interested. I was talking to one of my brothers freinds brother and he really liked he mod and was asking me all these questions on msn about it. Some mapping freinds who have playin the mod get "ideas" from it. White now plays my mod for fun instead of being forced, I have had to beg some of my freinds to not leak the details and features of the mod. Personally, I am amazed by some of the stuff I have pulled of like the highway bridge that you guys could play later. Its a bit later on in the seacond level.

But I know, I know you make your own opinions and dont know till you play...

Anyway its hard to communicate the details of a mod through a few screenshots. Theres the ai, sound, weapons.... so many things that can't be communicated through pictures. But its not about the encounter of the area, its the geometry in the level.

Thanks for youre blessing :smile: , crono.

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Aaron's Stuff

you idiot aaron. why did you show them this part of the level for. the third level is better. show them that.

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i like drinking coke with my pizza

Too square-y! Lets have some curved architecture, some angles which aren't 90 degrees. At the moment it all feels a little stale because of the brushwork.

i dont think this is the best part of your map

Nightseeker said:
i dont think this is the best part of your map

Well, thanks I guess :smile: . Welcome to snarkpit Nightseeker.

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Aaron's Stuff

Well, you seem to be actually pulling this through so I think you deserve some respect for this fact alone. And the screens don't look bad at all. Which doesn't mean they look "amazing" quite yet.

At first: Add some lights, this is awfully dark. Most of the lights hardly reach the floor at any reasonable intensity. Imagine most players not even seeing where they're going. I had to turn my monitor to maximum brightness to even make out the architecture.

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Why snark works.

Thanks mate :smile:

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Aaron's Stuff

This is General. You've been coming here for way too long to s**t on the forums like this.

This is General. You've been coming here for way too long to s**t on the forums like this.

?

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Reality has become a commodity.

It should be in the maps forum. I didn't realize he was a member for over a year before he did this.

There are ways to submit a "mod" as your map, though. You just have to be a little clever about it.

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Blame it on Microsoft, God does.

Cassius said:
This is General. You've been coming here for way too long to s**t on the forums like this.

I think you should read every post before you comment Cassius :rolleyes:

edit: I said before in an early post that reno could move this thread if he wants to, and its still here.

And anyway, I am asking peoples opinion (poll) if they like the four screenshots. I am not releasing a map, or talking about any particular map from my mod. I am getting a general idea about what peoples expectations are when it comes to a goldsource mod.

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Aaron's Stuff

Cassius said:
This is General. You've been coming here for way too long to s**t on the forums like this.

I think you should read every post before you comment Cassius :rolleyes:

I think you should read the descriptions for forum subsections before you post in them. Actually, I'll phrase that in the imperative: read the descriptions for forum subsections before you post in them. This wouldn't be a problem, really, if you were a good poster or if this were a good map. It's a gray-on-gray-on-yellowish-gray-on-black swamp. You didn't even bother to texture the boxes that flood your nearly featureless rooms and still had the gall to post their pictures here and, most inexplicably, brag about them. What, ostensibly, do they represent? A "storm water sewer?" Does it rain crates in your mod's alternate universe?

I am getting a general idea about what peoples expectations are when it comes to a goldsource mod.

Here's a general idea of what the General Banter forum is for: general, non-mapping-related banter. Here's a general idea of the expectations of anyone whose opinion is even a touch informed by expertise or good taste: we expect your map to include more than two colors; we expect your map to provide forms of cover other than pillars and crates; and we expect you to let your map speak for itself, rather than to hear you tell us how great it is in this or that respect. Here's my general idea of what your expectations were when you posted this: you wanted to be congratulated on having thrown together a series of undetailed rooms in which you planted a series of weapon and monster entities. I urge you not to rub yourself too hard. Post this in Maps and I'll comment more specifically on the map itself.

Don't be a f****n nub Cassius. These are pictures of one specific encounter space of one particular map from the second level of the campaign of my mod. What am I going to do, make a new map profile for four pictures? And how am I going to have a poll? The question is simply, do you like or dislike the shots. People can give an extended response of why they liked/dis liked the screen shots or offer advice on how to make the area better.

And there is no need to convey your opinion in such a harsh way. I read all the posts and take them all seriously.

Cassius said:
You didn't even bother to texture the boxes

The mod was and still is in development. Everything you see in the picture is subject to change. What you see on the crate is a place holder texture. It will be there until I find or make a texture for it. It might not even be a crate.

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Aaron's Stuff

Well, I'm all for keeping the forum system clean but I have to defend aaron here. This might be a debatable example, but the map forums are very restrictive and if you want to make it clear a post is about a mod it's slightly more logical to post in General Banter than in the Maps forum. Although I don't see how useful a poll is in this case. I hope there will be a more flexible solution for this kind of categorizing in the brand NEW Snarkpit.

[edit: I posted this before aaron called Cassius a "f****n nub"... ]

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Why snark works.

Don't be a f****n nub Cassius.

Nub, corruption of noob, corruption of newb, contraction of newbie. Denotes a newcomer, especially one only clumsily acquainted with or below the standards of the community he's recently entered.

These are pictures of one specific encounter space of one particular map from the second level of the campaign of my mod. What am I going to do, make a new map profile for four pictures?

Yes.

And how am I going to have a poll?

You shouldn't, because a poll will not bring you any valuable criticism. You just wanted to see people vote that they liked it.

And there is no need to convey your opinion in such a harsh way.

Rather, there would have been no way to convey my harsh opinion politely. Had you innocently posted a bad map, I wouldn't have been annoyed, but you've posted a bad map and you're full of yourself over it. You're so full of yourself over it it that you've posted it in the wrong section just to draw more attention to it. You're so full of yourself over it that you've obliquely commented on how amazed you are at what you've been able to do with it. That's what I'm objecting to.

aaron_da_killa said:
Don't be a f****n nub Cassius

Correction, stop being a nub. You may have been here alot longer than me, and know alot more about online "Netiquette" than me, but it doesn't take a dumbass to figure out when someone is acting like an idiot.

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Aaron's Stuff

Correction, stop being a nub. You may have been here alot longer than me, and know alot more about online "Netiquette" than me, but it doesn't take a dumbass to figure out when someone is acting like an idiot.

No, it doesn't take a dumbass. Dumbasses, indeed, are rather incapable of telling when others -- or they themselves -- are making dumb decisions. Hence your facial hair. You've presented a bad map in the wrong forum with the wrong attitude. Justify yourself or delete the post. I wonder: will you actually reply of something of substance this time, or keep tossing Counter-Strike slang my way?

This argument is pointless, I have more important things to do than argue with you Cassius.

Does anybody else have any comments on the pictures?

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Aaron's Stuff

No, this argument is one in which you found yourself utterly incapable of reasoning your position. But if the moderators won't take responsibility for this, I won't either.

Whatever helps you sleep at night dude. I'm not going to reply to your arguments anymore, if you have something to say about the shots, feel free, otherwise, you can stop being an idiot now.

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Aaron's Stuff

Ahhhhhh its great to see the ol' pit back to normal. Cass I <3 you so much! We all miss you deep down in places we don't talk about :biggrin: .

Anyways arron I tend to agree with cass, create a map profile called "Red Dawn Mod" Then you can create a thread over in the map section titled: "Red Dawn Screen Shot Campaign". Then you can break the thread into chapters so you can do first wave chapter then second wave...etc.

And yeah: posted comments > your poll options (Thats the greater than symbol).

While I think the argument has gone far off topic, please just let this thread die (in fact I think a moderator might lock it tomorrow) and move it over to the map section.

BTW what you just experienced arron....was the pit....welcome to the snarkpit.

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Posting And You

Hahahaa, thanks :smile: Well I'm sure these problems will be solved in the new snarkpit.

Cassius, this was stupid, we are both humans, with similar interests. Peace?

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Aaron's Stuff