Say hi to our newest member, QuartzRaven!
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Riven said:
Aaron's map has SOO many static props...
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aaron_da_killa said:Ok, first things first: The hallways could potentially be pretty boring; I agree. But they have a lot of potential to really create interesting conflicts. That-is, if we use new concepts for DM. I was thinking of a moving ramp. You know, they kind you can stand on and they get you from one end of an airport the the other? Basically a conveyor belt? Well, imagine two conveyor belts that had a system of letting only one person on them at a time. and they were parallel with one another. Well, there could be a glass wall that separated both of them and there would be windows along the glass wall that would open up to allow for gun fire along the way. So if one person was following a weaker player and they both hop onto a conveyor belt, then one player could potentially even the odds by deploying off handed tactics, like walking in the opposite direction to 'stand still'.
- Damn those hallways are boring, I really hope they are made shorter, less linear and way more interesting. I really hope we implement some crazy ideas such as the underwater idea or outer space etc for those hallways.
- Riven's map really slows down the gameplay, not that this is particularly a bad thing, but I wonder how it would play out with alot of players, would there be any conflict with the use of those movable rooms?
- RedWood's and Hotdog 2's section feel isolated. Dead end, argh!
- Hmm, performance dropped on Hotdog 2's map.
- Blowing up the explosive drums is fun.
- I wonder how it would play out with teleporters at the end of the existing unused possible entries/exits
- Overall, I think Riven has done a good job smiley.
Muhnay said:Well, the map layout isn't finished yet. The square halls are just halls because they are place holders. I didn't go through them and give 'em any detail whatsoever yet. Don't worry, there will be detail there and they certainly won't look like that for long :lol:.
I don't like it. It is not instinctive, where you think there should be a connection there is not.
Riven I got to see your map finally, and I have to say I would of not voted for it. It has some great movement and ideas, but there is too much going on, its not conductive to game play... also the sound is loud and annoying.. you don't want to be near it for long.
It is also missing many parts.. the halls are just that halls.. you the man of architecture and substance just made square halls.. you gave me a long speech about my Lasertag map being too boxy and then give us this? Come on man.
Other than that I have to agree with Aaron assessment.
( I really need that Glow Ball for my lasertag map.. =))
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muhnay said:Perhaps you ought to put pen (or pencil) to paper and draw yourself a floor plan or some sort of layout for your map, I find it helps when your constructing a map. Might also be a good idea to do a google search for "laser tag" and "laser tag arena" to get yourself some soild images to work off. Images such as this, this, thisand this may aid you in the creation of your map.
No not at all.. If I could put the vision in my head to hammer and make it come out.. I think you would be amazed.. I don't have the skills yet to get it where I want, and as you know its a CSS map, and laser tag arenas tend to be boxy.
DrGlass
Zein
Zein said:well Riven has said he needs more train station
MORE PROGRESS PLEASE! i want to see this thing goin!
haymaker said:I hope Riven doesn't mind me speaking about this, I can't really think of any reason why I shouldn't, but I'm making a train depot for the compilation map, sadly, I haven't been able to work on it for a few weeks because I have been ridiculously busy with school and am working on a flash platform game for my multimedia project which I urgently need to get finished asap as the deadline looms and I have yet to do alot of programming and so on. I have a two week break coming up though in less than 3 weeks so it will most certainly be done by then. Here are some screenshots (really heavy wip, I'm not quite happy with it yet):
Zein said:well Riven has said he needs more train station
MORE PROGRESS PLEASE! i want to see this thing goin!
aaron_da_killa said:-We're trying to keep the custom content on this map low. Beyond the trophies and decals, I would rather everything else be original assets from the game itself. That's how the competition was run, and that's how I think the map as an entirety should run. Normally I wouldn't care what content you'd want to use, but in this case I don't see the need to have wet rocks. If it's not in the original art assets of the game, then you'll have to find the next closest thing to it. That's the creativity in it. Using what's at hand to make something original.
I'm going to use a few sharer effects (reflection/wet shine) and possibly use a custom rock texture for those rocky walls if Riven lets me
RedWood said:Thanks, that exit pathway on the platform is actually leading to your map. I'm going to make a sign in decal form for that pathway like maybe "Loading Depot" or "Warehouse" or whatnot. I was wondering what exactly your map is and if you had any ideas of what you wanted on the sign, after it sort of "belongs" to your level in spirit.
Looking good!!!
The playable area in the thing is going to be huge.
! GREAT!
The little work I have done isn't worth showing at the moment, but I actually think I'll have some more time to work on this next weekend and get the tracks done... (finally) Remember, there other positions open for anyone interested! Remember when I posted:
my earlier self said:^^^All that is still open to anyone interested!
Now, what remains before we can make an Alpha_2 release is:
1. completing construction of train tunnels
2. Complete assembling train and get working with tracks and timing
3. Construct connection hall between Redwood's map and Hlife_hotdog's cave map
4. Construct connection hall between Aaron_da_killa's map and Hlife-Hotdog's "Valve Studios" map
5. Construct connection hall between Aaron_da_killa's map and Riven's map
6. Construct connection hall between Hlife-Hotdog's "Valve Studios" map and Riven's map
7. Construct connection hall between Riven's map and Natus' map
8. Add in spaces for individual trophy models and individual plaque decals.
9. Create Plaque decals and place in map.
Now any of the items in that list I have no problem lending to others to work on individually. There are no deadlines and I don't care who would want to do it. If you have time, you're eligible!
"Riven" said:You can if you crouch jump off the tracks, I was thinking about putting a ladder there but I hate the way you have to do ladders in Source so I was going to let you do it
Can you jump up on the platform?
. I'm not even sure how to do it.
"Riven" said:That's fine but I think that we should force players to stay out, I really don't like the idea of clips or locking in the player. I think rather we should deter the players from entering the tunnel, best way to do that in my opinion is to kill players who venture in there, perhaps the rails should be electrified after all and we should have sections in the tunnel where the only thing the player can stand on is the rail thus leading to death (monorail as you said), the combine shields are ok I think but I kind of feel like its just a fancy clip brush. This is cool for a few reasons:
but we can't let the players run up and down the train tunnel. I want that to be a non-playable space because as it's looking now, it's really long and boring.
aaron_da_killa said:Strange, i didn't get any incoming messages today.
Thanks, that exit pathway on the platform is actually leading to your map. I'm going to make a sign in decal form for that pathway like maybe "Loading Depot" or "Warehouse" or whatnot. I was wondering what exactly your map is and if you had any ideas of what you wanted on the sign, after it sort of "belongs" to your level in spirit.
I tried contacting you on steam but it seems you weren't there.
haymaker said:Thanks
yeah Redwood there was a default light_env in the template. Your standalone bsp had a fair amount of light coming through the windows, it made for a nice bright map.
haymaker said:Well not much, would just need to modify a few things around it, the player wouldn't be able to crouch jump off the tracks onto the platform anymore. If any adjustments need to be made to the train depot I'm working on I think I'd prefer if the track was sunk as opposed to raising the platform. I don't think I need any adjustments though.. it was a long time ago, but I'm pretty sure I checked that everything was the right height for the train.
Aaron, what would happen if you raised just the track section at the platform to that 30 unit difference?
Riven said:Why do we need so much track for? I mean, this doesn't have to be exactly like a conventional train does it? We can stylize it up a little. Instead of having a large and very bulky curve couldn't we use turn tables instead? I think it would be more suitable than having large bulky track sections, although it would be sweet riding through them at full speed!
So I hammered out a train tunnel that would span over the map and connect associated areas together. Upon making many test compiles of it (including a 30 min. full lighting compile) The map simply couldn't handle the number of twists and angles of all the track pieces (the actual tunnels themselves, if not lined up to the grid was too much for the engine to bother rendering even when split up). So I swallowed the sour pill and realized that the tunnel geometry would just have to be modeled so that vis could have an easy job. There is literally about 1/2 a Kilometer of track that spans over the course of the map.
Riven said:I don't think teleporting is such a good idea. It's always a little sad for me when I see shortcuts in games and the notion of having the train teleport feels like a shortcut to me. I think that with the use of turn tables, we could build much shorter sections of linear, 90 degree track (which is much easier than curves) and if we simply optimize the speed of the train so that it travels at a comfortable speed for a multiplayer game, players would enjoy or wouldn't be pissed off by a trip in the train even though they want to get to the next station and get some frags asap.
The train will teleport in both directions.
Riven said:Actually, the amount of server side processing required for this would be very minimal and in fact I should hope that it would take slightly less server side processing if the two trains where 'anchored' together, unless Valve didn't do their networking code correctly.
There will be one car for the train itself as opposed to two. Two cars would be too much for the server to calculate especially if they are 'anchored' to one another and pivot as they go around corners. I'll admit that it would be cool to jump from one moving car to another, but it would probably too much for the server to render simultaneously, since func_tracktrains are server side.
Riven said:It's nice to see the metric system being used by the Americans :). I've started to notice that its being used increasingly in American games/movies/conversation.
There is literally about 1/2 a Kilometer of track
haymaker said:-Yes, the turning radius for the preliminary train I have built fits perfectly within the walls and angles of the tunnels I designed. I tested it by copy/pasting iterations of the train in Hammer (kinda like images taken of a moving object and it's ghost path) and figured out a rough size with very small leeway. 'Just enough' was the idea and it should fit quite nicely. The In-XSI shot I have posted in my last post reflects an area that will be pitch-black as the train turns the corner. THAT angle is actually too sharp, but that was done on purpose, so that players peering down the hall would see a sudden cut of view from looking down the tunnel. The train will not actually pass all the way through that angle. That angle will be part of the 'teleport zone' Now, the very large circle you see in the last image is train-ready. that reflects the smooth curve needed to direct the train through a 180.
I'm curious how you dealt with the turning radius problem, those corners look hella smaller than the ones I needed to make the train not collide with the wall. I guess if they're static props they could be made nonsolid? or did you come up with another solution?
haymaker said:Yes, and very minimally at that (It's also why the resolution on the tunnel model is so low; players will be speeding through them at 80Km/hr and it will be partially black. The lighting will be spotted along the way). And because the train itself will be built of brushes, I envision a lightmap baked into the train interior elsewhere (just one light that can be turned on and off). So as the train travels from spot-light to spot-light, there can actually be trigger volumes that the train passes through that would turn on and off the lightmaps within the car to simulate the lighting from the tunnel passing by. In the end I imagine it looking like a slow strobe light effect that would pick up as the train moved faster (also cued by higher-pitched tram sounds) making for a dramatic fighting environment, or just fun to watch.
And I'm inferring that you plan to have lighting throughout the tunnels somewhat?
aaron_da_killa said:-I understand what you mean too. I don't like shortcuts either, but what I describe as teleporting, the player would simply describe as a longer section of pitch-blackness. That is, the player won't know they just teleported. It will all be hidden. So, had I not told you, you may not have known. (other than by looking at the diagram yourself, which the player will never see).
I don't think teleporting is such a good idea. It's always a little sad for me when I see shortcuts in games and the notion of having the train teleport feels like a shortcut to me.
Simply because it's not just horizontal ways, but the track also changes elevation as it goes along. If we did choose to do it, there would be about 3 turntables at least in order to make it work efficiently. And yes, those would make for shorter amounts of track, but would it be less enjoyable? -I suppose it breaks down to what's more fun I guess.
aaron_da_killa said:-I'm glad you noticed! -I don't know about it being reflective of american standards changing in general, but it certainly is a personal goal of mine. I can tell you as an architecture student and having a father who's a civil engineer, we're hard-pressed into the imperial system. We're not required in the least to bother designing anything in metric. I only have an imperial architects scale and not a metric one. But I feel the internet has standards, and those standards are whatever the world's majority is, so when I approach the internet, I respect the metric system. But if you were to visit me here in the usa, I would describe things to you in feet, inches, and miles. -I highly doubt the US will be switching anytime soon, even though I would prefer the metric system (don't tell my dad!).
It's nice to see the metric system being used by the Americans
