Denmark = screwed?

You have a point too about their views being imposed on us, and how the
West is under attack for it's values yet we have that right too.

I don't think there's a clear way to define right or wrong here, but I
do think that the boycotting reaction is a little over the top, if
understandable. As for the likelihood of Denmark being attacked by
terrorists.. - I'd say the chances are very slim at the most.

Gwil said:
You have a point too about their views being imposed on us, and how the West is under attack for it's values yet we have that right too.

I don't think there's a clear way to define right or wrong here, but I do think that the boycotting reaction is a little over the top, if understandable. As for the likelihood of Denmark being attacked by terrorists.. - I'd say the chances are very slim at the most.

100% Agreement here.

---

Help stop the arsehole: http://ebaumsworldsucks.com/

Gwil said:
As for the likelihood of Denmark being attacked by terrorists.. - I'd say the chances are very slim at the most.

IMO, the likelihood is no more or less a probability than any other country's chances at this point. I am not predisposed to terrorism so my thinking is a bit harder to establish, where motive is an enticement but, I cannot see any pattern when it happens. Terrorist seem to just seem to want to do it. Its like dogs that chase cars, no matter how many get squished, they just seem to want to continue doing it as a breed. The main problem with dogs, and terrorist for that matter is, the ones doing it so often die that there is no learning precess. The next dog chases the car and dies without passing on the learning experience of "Hey guys, those big things hurt you"

/passive thoughts.

---

The best things in life, aren't things.

Orpheus said:
<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Gwil</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>As for the likelihood of Denmark being attacked by terrorists.. - I'd say the chances are very slim at the most.

IMO, the likelihood is no more or less a probability than any other country's chances at this point. I am not predisposed to terrorism so my thinking is a bit harder to establish, where motive is an enticement but, I cannot see any pattern when it happens. Terrorist seem to just seem to want to do it. Its like dogs that chase cars, no matter how many get squished, they just seem to want to continue doing it as a breed. The main problem with dogs, and terrorist for that matter is, the ones doing it so often die that there is no learning precess. The next dog chases the car and dies without passing on the learning experience of "Hey guys, those big things hurt you"

/passive thoughts.</div></div>

As late as yersterday, the police/government/someone/whatever found a homepage where someone stated that "I'm going to bomb myself in Denmark" with some pictures of streets in Copenhagen bound to the message.

Personally, i think it's only a question of time, since even before this comic was made, Denmark was allready threatened by terrorist, mainly because of the Iraq war. And now that the comic came, there's an even bigger chance.

So for me, the chances are that Denmark is going to be an offer for a bomb, it's only a question of time. And i would almost say that it's a fact, that SOMEONE out there is planning a terror action on Denmark, succes or not!
Anyways, at lest some good news! Muslims in Denmark have accepted Jyllands-postens so called "apologize", though that wouldn't be the exact word i would use. Now they are planning to send someone to the Islamic countries and blah blah, i have to go now!

Looks like the Europeans are taking sides.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4670370.stm

Here's a hypothetical: What if Germany were to say, "the UK stinks and are a bunch of losers". UK starts to boycott German products and France were to stand up and say "how dare you boycott". I mean, its not like the Muslims are recalling ambassadors or getting ready for war. They can buy whatever products they prefer. I realize it may be unreasonable for them to punish a whole country for the state owned newspaper, but what other option do they have. If they associate the paper with the views of other Danish people, Denmark needs to do something to seperate themselves from that view. If they do share the view of the paper, Muslims have every right to boycott.

---

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it was on the national news here tonight, showing french muslims immigrants/students/hippies burning danish flags on the streets of paris. why they would have a can of petrol and a danish flag is a mystery, but the camera crew must have been really lucky to have found them at the very moment the petrol was being poured.

why this was passed as being newsworthy, is also a mystery. none of the images were shown, so it wasn't a show of solidarity with the danish, french, dutch, and some other european countries that have reproduced them in the wake of the protest. it seemed to be aimed more at causing a knee-jerk reaction by joe puplic, along the lines of, "wtf's wrong with these muslims". tbh, i thought the way the story was presented was a lot more sinister than the original cartoons.

---

i eat paint

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Dark|Killer</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Well, what denmark made, is really cruel, they humilated us so badly, by drawing our prophet and making fun of our religion, islam, and or prophet, mohammed, and i heard that they are truely burning the denmark flag, plus boycotting loads of products, which i really liked ie choclates and cheese products...
But the problem here is that none of our leaders stand up against that act...

Well, that drawing really made me mad,its all over emails talking about denmark, the drawer,and the drawing itself...
also, i didnt like the way they humilated us, its not the first time, for we had alot of other cruel humilation against our religion...
</DIV></DIV>

I just wanna start by covering my backside and saying. "I don't hate muslims." Now that I've said that, I can start hatin' on muslims. :smile: Not really. EVERY religion gets cruel humiliation! The USA is a "Christian Nation" and even CHRISTIANS get humiliated. The only thing that is different here, is that the muslims don't seem to realize that there are some people who DON'T beleive in God and don't CARE. It's most of those people that are the liberal douchebags that are always trying to "push the envelope" like Michael Moore.

I read a story in the news today that quoted a Muslim leader as saying "If it had been about a Jewish Rabbi, it never would've been published." But I think it would have been. Some rock music guy wore a shirt on his tour that said "ABORT CHRIST." There was no huge backlash. Only the Muslims seem to make trouble on an international level when something like this happens. They want all the political correctness of a wester country, but they don't want the responsibility and they dont want to give thier people the rights.

Freeman: so you're saying that people being nice is not good if they are religious? you'd just say we are evil for being not nice, if we were mean to you. Personally, I think your whole post was you trying to find resons NOT to like the GOOD religious people, when you really can't find a good reason.

Well, i know i already said i didnt want to post in this topic anymore, but i just wanted to point out something for you freeman, if you were saved by the firefighters, you would say that they saved you, right ? not God...But how did they put the fire off ?? using water...And how did they get water, from oceans and lakes etc.. now the real questions is... Who created Water ?? well obviously, God did, so if God didnt create water, there wouldnt be any ocean\lakes etc. , (and so we cant live anyway ) and the firefighters wouldnt have found anything to turn the fire off with...

So I could do this small summery God--->Water--->Firemen use it---> save your life..

Thats how you could think correctly, and wont be a fool :smile:

---

.::Dark|Masta::. - One name. One legend.

and thus god created the fire to start with? bastard.

---

My Pit

if someone is trapped in a building on fire, its his fate, and he cant change it, so at that moment, he is in between the hands of God..
And God created fire for different uses.For instance, using fire in a wrong way, would most probably cause trouble...In contrast, using it in the right way, you would most probably avoid getting hurt...

And please, dont call me a bastard, i said i didnt want this topic to ruin the friendship between us all...

-Anyway this is all off the topic...

---

.::Dark|Masta::. - One name. One legend.

Actually dark|Killer, I hope you DO post more on this topic. Id would be interesting to hear your perspective. I don't know that many people from the middle-east, you're one of about 3. keep posting!

BTW, he was calling GOD a bastard, not you. But you don't see me "boy-cutting" stuff from UK. I just love Heinz Treacle too much!

Anyway, God created the fire. But most likely it was started because of sin.

I don't know how many times I have to explain this, so I'll go get my quote on it.

Nickelplate said:
I'll quote something I've said before that applies:

In the bible, Abraham was told that God was going to give him a son and that the son would become a great nation. Abraham got tired of waiting for God, so he and his wife Sarah, took things into thier own hands and decided that Abraham should impregnate Hagar, Sarah's maidservant. Her son was Ishmael. Then a bit later, Sarah also became pregnant and had Isaac, whose descendants are the tribes of Israel.

God also said he would turn Ishmael into a great nation. Ishmael's descendants are the people who we now refer to as "Muslims." Pretty much everyone ranging from Iraq down to Saudi Arabia.

Because of Abraham's sin of adultery with Hagar, People even now are suffering because of these people who are the direct result of his sin. I wanted to write this to explain that this is why bad things happen to good people. Because God gave Abraham free will, and by his free will he chose something that resulted in bad things happening to good people. If God took away the consequences of Abraham's actions, then he may as well have not had free will to begin with. This is the answer to the question I'm SO sick of hearing: "Why does such a loving god let bad things happen to good people?"

It's not only because of thier sins, It's because of the sins of others. Just like we are ALL paying for abraham's sin because now we have to deal with these muslim Extremists. Also, this is the reason why Christians try to SPREAD the gospel... Not to piss ppl off or to get more money (stuff i've heard, really) They do it because they don't like ppl going to hell, and they want them to go to heaven and be nice ppl and stuff. see? The decisions you make will not only affect you, but your children too. and thier children and so on. Because if god takes away the consequences of your actions, then did you really have free will to begin with?

Anyway, it's our free will that results in sin. And the bible says "For the wages of sin is death," and it's true.

But nickelplate, I had enough of this post, in the end, its leading to no where, so i cant find it so intresting to full-fill my needs..

---

.::Dark|Masta::. - One name. One legend.

Nickelplate said:
<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Dark|Killer</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Well, what denmark made, is really cruel, they humilated us so badly, by drawing our prophet and making fun of our religion, islam, and or prophet, mohammed, and i heard that they are truely burning the denmark flag, plus boycotting loads of products, which i really liked ie choclates and cheese products...
But the problem here is that none of our leaders stand up against that act...

Well, that drawing really made me mad,its all over emails talking about denmark, the drawer,and the drawing itself...
also, i didnt like the way they humilated us, its not the first time, for we had alot of other cruel humilation against our religion...

I just wanna start by covering my backside and saying. "I don't hate muslims." Now that I've said that, I can start hatin' on muslims. :smile: Not really. EVERY religion gets cruel humiliation! The USA is a "Christian Nation" and even CHRISTIANS get humiliated. The only thing that is different here, is that the muslims don't seem to realize that there are some people who DON'T beleive in God and don't CARE. It's most of those people that are the liberal douchebags that are always trying to "push the envelope" like Michael Moore.

I read a story in the news today that quoted a Muslim leader as saying "If it had been about a Jewish Rabbi, it never would've been published." But I think it would have been. Some rock music guy wore a shirt on his tour that said "ABORT CHRIST." There was no huge backlash. Only the Muslims seem to make trouble on an international level when something like this happens. They want all the political correctness of a wester country, but they don't want the responsibility and they dont want to give thier people the rights.

Freeman: so you're saying that people being nice is not good if they are religious? you'd just say we are evil for being not nice, if we were mean to you. Personally, I think your whole post was you trying to find resons NOT to like the GOOD religious people, when you really can't find a good reason.</div></div>
I can't agree more, they are international troublemakers (some of them).
Just tell me, WHY does almost EVERY conflict in the world include MUSLIMS?!
Just think about it, 9/11, abductions, those drawing, Iraq, almost everything!

Muslims have no sense of humour... I'm sure the Prophet himself would have appreciated that joke.

If this boycott continues, I feel that a lot of things "are gonna be rotten in the kingdom of Denmark"...

if someone is trapped in a building on fire, its his fate, and
he cant change it, so at that moment, he is in between the hands of
God..
And God created fire for different uses.For instance, using
fire in a wrong way, would most probably cause trouble...In contrast,
using it in the right way, you would most probably avoid getting hurt...

And please, dont call me a bastard, i said i didnt want this topic to ruin the friendship between us all...

-Anyway this is all off the topic...

I was reffering to god. although the fate thing makes me wish I hadnt tbh.

---

My Pit

Just tell me, WHY does almost EVERY conflict in the world include MUSLIMS?!

So Iraq had links to Muslims directly as fanatics, and was made out of their choice?

A secular state by Arabic standards invaded illegally, and on the basis of lies, by prominent western states..

So Palestine chooses to be shelled, occupied and controlled by
Israel?

A recognised homeland repartitioned through UN guilt, a new
power exacting religious and racist genocide which it so suffered from
in the 30s/40s..

So Iran is wrong to be opressed by a theocratic government?

<br style="font-style: italic;">
A state exploited at first by the
west then maligned because they didn't toe the line? Didn't play ball
with capitalist marketing and pricings for the good of the markets..<br style="text-decoration: underline;">
<br style="text-decoration: underline;">
You clearly have no idea what youre talking about. Muslims aren't the evil that you portray them to be.

ALMOST EVERY CONFLICT THAT INVOLVES MUSLIMS IN THE WORLD IS A DIRECT
RESULT OF COLD WAR AND UN MEDDLINGS, INTERFERENCE AND ATTEMPT TO
CONTROL STATES.

DONT s**t ON THE COUNTRIES THAT YOU s**t ON, STIRRED IT AND THEN RAN AWAY AND SAID "FREEDOM OPPRESSORS!"

THAT'S "WHY"

All your religions are but of mine.. So bow down suckers..

PAGANS.. thats right.. your all basterd PAGANS.. except for you there in the corner.. were not quite sure what you are yet

Gwil said:
<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Just tell me, WHY does almost EVERY conflict in the world include MUSLIMS?!

So Iraq had links to Muslims directly as fanatics, and was made out of their choice?

A secular state by Arabic standards invaded illegally, and on the basis of lies, by prominent western states..

So Palestine chooses to be shelled, occupied and controlled by Israel?

A recognised homeland repartitioned through UN guilt, a new power exacting religious and racist genocide which it so suffered from in the 30s/40s..

So Iran is wrong to be opressed by a theocratic government?
<BR style="FONT-STYLE: italic">A state exploited at first by the west then maligned because they didn't toe the line? Didn't play ball with capitalist marketing and pricings for the good of the markets..<BR style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"><BR style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">You clearly have no idea what youre talking about. Muslims aren't the evil that you portray them to be.

ALMOST EVERY CONFLICT THAT INVOLVES MUSLIMS IN THE WORLD IS A DIRECT RESULT OF COLD WAR AND UN MEDDLINGS, INTERFERENCE AND ATTEMPT TO CONTROL STATES.

DONT s**t ON THE COUNTRIES THAT YOU s**t ON, STIRRED IT AND THEN RAN AWAY AND SAID "FREEDOM OPPRESSORS!"

THAT'S "WHY"
</div></div>

I like your text formatting.

a lot worse happened to north and south american indians, and I don't see THEM saying that "the great spirit" is telling them to bomb stuff. I don't hear pre-roman age European peoples saying "Uath tells us to bomb stuff!" or "ODIN ODIN!! JIHAD!"

Basically EVERY kind of person at one time or another has been shat on, and every type of person has been the one doing the s**tting. It's how they are handling it that is evil. Guerrilla tactics, suicide bombs, Hijacking planes.

Yes, pretty much every religion says that every OTHER religion is wrong, but Muslims are the only ones who wanna kill over it. Everyone else is trying to peacefully convert ppl, IF they are converting at all!

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

Jews kill over it.

Hindus kill over it (yep, Hindus!)

I don't disagree entirely with some points on muslim attitudes and how
Islam dictates "conversion or die", but to portray some of the most
published and well known problems as involving Muslims, is merely
another way of saying "it's their fault" - when it clearly isn't.

Also i'd wager the way our nations have acted as recently as the 20th
century in conflicts seen and unseen commited some pretty horrendous
acts and atrocities against our enemies. How about The Luftwaffe/Bomber
Command for murdering of civilians? I know it's not exactly a context
where you can draw parallels, but it is fair to say that both
situations are warfare. Warfare - that which brings out the worst in
mankind.

I agree :smile:

---

.::Dark|Masta::. - One name. One legend.

Dark|Killer said:
Well, i know i already said i didnt want to post in this topic anymore, but i just wanted to point out something for you freeman, if you were saved by the firefighters, you would say that they saved you, right ? not God...But how did they put the fire off ?? using water...And how did they get water, from oceans and lakes etc.. now the real questions is... Who created Water ?? well obviously, God did, so if God didnt create water, there wouldnt be any ocean\lakes etc. , (and so we cant live anyway ) and the firefighters wouldnt have found anything to turn the fire off with...

So I could do this small summery God--->Water--->Firemen use it---> save your life..

Thats how you could think correctly, and wont be a fool :smile:

You have to predispose that there is some mystical being called God that created the water. If you believe it God, then so be it, if not, it sounds to us like a person with a belief that expressed his opinion on how it is, and the rest of us just roll our eyes.

---

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My understanding is that Islam forbids depicting Mohammed in any way, solely to prevent idolatry, which is clearly not what's going to happen from this negative portrayal of him. However I'm sure most of the anger is simply directed at the cartoon meaning to cause offence to all Muslims by suggesting that they're all suicide bombers or terrorists, rather than just at them breaking this rule. But I'm afraid that I have to agree with the editor of that Jordanian paper who was fired for suggested that executing people on TV is a far worse offence that a set of drawings, and, from an Atheist standpoint, it saddens me to see such a massively unintelligent and over-emotional response so far from the vocal parts of the Arab world who follow a religion even more flawed than Christianity. /free speech

(I hope someone understands the real point I'm trying to make here :razz: )

It was put well on Radio 4's Thought of the Day (by a Rabbi, incidentally) -

Free speech is the right to express ideas such as these cartoons, but it is not an obligation to deliberately inflame tension.

Paraphrased, but that's the general jist.

Leperous said:
My understanding is that Islam forbids depicting Mohammed in any way, solely to prevent idolatry, which is clearly not what's going to happen from this negative portrayal of him. However I'm sure most of the anger is simply directed at the cartoon meaning to cause offence to all Muslims by suggesting that they're all suicide bombers or terrorists, rather than just at them breaking this rule. But I'm afraid that I have to agree with the editor of that Jordanian paper who was fired for suggested that executing people on TV is a far worse offence that a set of drawings, and, from an Atheist standpoint, it saddens me to see such a massively unintelligent and over-emotional response so far from the vocal parts of the Arab world who follow a religion even more flawed than Christianity. /free speech

(I hope someone understands the real point I'm trying to make here :razz: )

Good point about the hostage executions versus the drawings. Perhaps they should post the drawings for a week everytime someone is executed by the insurgents. If the Islamic community put as much pressure on those killers of innocent hostages as they do on Denmark produce, the problem would be solved. No, I'm not suggesting that the Islamic community promotes the killings, but they sure don't seem to be complaining that much about it (endorcement by silence). Or at least our press doesn't show any Islamic outrage over the hostages anyway.

---

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I haven't been able to read all the replies in this thread, but after
reading a few newspaper articles on the subject, I wanted to chime
in.

This is a really sticky issue, becuase I don't see how western notions
of free speech can be reconciled with what the religous consider to be
blasphemous.

I don't think telling Muslims to "lighten up" is really the
solution. I know that the extreme and violent reactions of
Muslims all over the world (in Indonesia for example... it's not just a
Middle East thing) shows that this is a very serious offense in their
eyes... which is something I don't think everyone is willing to
see. Personally, I very much believe in free speech, but I
wouldn't want to say something (or draw a cartoon about something) that
would succeed in seriously offending millions of people.

From a libertarian website speaking of hypocrisy:

• Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
• A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
• Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage
• Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
• Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.

---

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i agree with freeman. let's all be quiet, in case we offend anyone.

bah, all this s**t done in the name of islam WILL be be blamed on islam, until 'real' muslims have the balls to stand against what is happning in the name of their god.

if they don't, tensions can only increase.

---

i eat paint

fishy said:
i agree with freeman. let's all be quiet, in case we offend anyone.

One problem. What do we do when no one has posted in a single thread for a few weeks?

makes mental note to update contact list

---

The best things in life, aren't things.

jeffjohnvol said:
From a libertarian website speaking of hypocrisy:

• Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
• A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
• Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage
• Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
• Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
• Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.

AHAHAHAHAA! Good point

Got an idea, how would the world be if every muslim turned into Christians/Non-believers/Whatever?

Nah, maybe a little drastic... :rolleyes:

THE fast-food chain, Burger King, is withdrawing its ice-cream cones after the lid of the dessert offended a Muslim.

The man claimed the design resembled the Arabic inscription for Allah, and branded it sacrilegious, threatening a "jihad".

The chain is being forced to spend thousands of pounds redesigning the
lid with backing from The Muslim Council of Britain. It apologised and
said: "The design simply represents a spinning ice-cream cone."

It's old, but made my laugh my tomsils out.

Freeman said:
O.K., guys this thread is now closed. And I noticed you used the "sarcastic" colour, fishy.

Notice I am not using blue text. This is not your thread, nor your site. Good thing really since we would have shot you ages ago and took it over.

---

The best things in life, aren't things.

Yeah, freeman- don't want to be the one to pick on you or anything (Much less side with Orph on an issue :razz: ), but if you don't want to participate in the thread, just don't participate. I don't really have much to say on the matter, and I really don't agree with some of the views in here, but I'm not going to go and tell them they can't post their views, or even say they can't discuss the issue.

You posting obnoxious red text telling everyone to stop posting isn't really going to prevent people from posting. People want to discuss this, and discuss they shall.

---

Shameless plug.

Monqui said:
(Much less side with Orph on an issue :razz: ),.

/giggles

No! Heaven forbid. :wink:

As for my name not being Fishy, not at the moment its not. I am betting that with his assistance, it could be.

whispers to fish

Quote me, but use your name.

---

The best things in life, aren't things.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Gwil</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Jews kill over it.

Hindus kill over it (yep, Hindus!)

I don't disagree entirely with some points on muslim attitudes and how Islam dictates "conversion or die", but to portray some of the most published and well known problems as involving Muslims, is merely another way of saying "it's their fault" - when it clearly isn't.

Also i'd wager the way our nations have acted as recently as the 20th century in conflicts seen and unseen commited some pretty horrendous acts and atrocities against our enemies. How about The Luftwaffe/Bomber Command for murdering of civilians? I know it's not exactly a context where you can draw parallels, but it is fair to say that both situations are warfare. Warfare - that which brings out the worst in mankind.
</DIV></DIV>

The only time the Jews ever killed other people is when they were conquering another land in biblical times. They didn't tell them to convert or die, they said, "Get out of the land we want" and they killed them.

I've never heard of Hindus killing anyone, can you gimme an example please?

The thing about the Luftwaffe and all that is that they were governed by an Atheist force, and they weren't trying to convert anyone either, they just wanted everyone else gone. True, war brings out the worst in people, but why do THESE people have to be in a CONSTANT war with EVERYONE ELSE?

I think that the only way to stop the "bad muslims" from doing crap like this is to make sure we publicly find thier remains, and drop them in a vat of pig's blood, thus sending them straight to hell, for everyone to see. Every time they do something to innocent people, we don't need to bomb and kill thier innocents, we need to take the guilty and make them "unclean" so they can't get into heaven with those 70-some virgins that they are always killing themselves for. Why kill THIER women and children with bombs just because they killed ours? that's not right. I say Pig-blood 'em! IF they know that this will happen to them every time they suicide bomb a place, they sure as hell won't suicide bomb.

---

I tried sniffing coke, but the ice cubes kept getting stuck in my nose.
http://www.dimebowl.com

I've never heard of Hindus killing anyone, can you gimme an example please?

I just took a class on the partitioning of India. When the
British split India and created Pakistan there was a lot of communal
violence involving Muslims and Hindus. I can't remember the exact
figures, but thousands of women were raped, and whole villages
exterminated. The violence was perpetrated by both Muslims and
Hindus during the very unstable, chaotic, and emotional period of
partitioning.

Maybe fraggard knows more about what happened. I tried to look
the events up on the wikipedia, but all factual accuracy of the
articles was in dispute.

My point about the luftwaffe wasn't about conversion, you're not
quoting in context to the post I was replying on. As for the Jews only
killing in biblical times - try the second half of the 20th century and
the 1990s for a rain check on that statement?

Again, i'm not talking about conversion - and even if I was, a lot of
these Muslim factions that carry out atrocities aren't even aimed at
conversion, they are based in rebellion at what is viewed as Western
values, and more importantly Western interests and stakes in the
Persian Gulf. In both the "peace treaties" offered to the USA and
Europe, Bin Laden made it a condition that western forces and their
allies, and business interests remove themselves from the "holy lands"

Hindus killing Muslims, I think for the other point - riots in
India/burning of a mosque a couple of years ago. Don't remember the ins
and outs, but it happened, and has happened before.

In case no-one caught it yet:

Danish embassy attacked

Norwegian embassy attacked

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Shameless plug.

This may, or may not have been brought up but...

When something so minor, leads to something so major, there is an underlying reason no one has mentioned yet.

Things never truly escalate from trivial to massive unless there are a series of trivialities that go uncorrected.

Course, some peoples just relish chaos and will join anything thats even remotely destructive.

shrugs

There is something missing in this puzzle. I refuse to believe its simply a case of cartoon humility. :rolleyes:

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The best things in life, aren't things.

My earlier post about the Muslims not pulling their ambassidor's is obviously not true any more. I saw where in Syria the protestors climbed the walls and set the embassy on fire. That's not Syrian property, but Denmark soil.

As much as I support their right to protest, if they had gone into the US or UK embassies, you'd have some dead muslims.

I'm glad the US is staying above the fray and not joining in the drawings though. Be looking for a lot of moohommed pictures on websites. Muhommed avatar's, anyone?

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Help stop the arsehole: http://ebaumsworldsucks.com/

The Godhra massacres (2002) - A train bogey carrying hindu religious
workers caught fire somehow. How it happened is under dispute, but it
was assumed at that time that it was a calculated move by muslim
fundies. It sparked of tensions leading to widespread riots and some
very gruesome murders of people of both religions by people of both
religions. It is claimed that the murders of muslims were encouraged by
the state government of Gujarat which had strong political connections
to fundie Hindu parties.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/1845817.stm

The destruction of the Babri mosque (1992) - One of the holiest islamic
monuments in India existed in one of the holiest hindu lands (Ayodhya).
An Indian political party, fundamentalist hindu at that time, took it
upon itself to destroy the mosque. It was destroyed and the local
police couldn't stop it. People believed that the administration did
not stop it because of their own religious leanings, and this set off
riots all over the country.

Graham Staines's murder - This australian christian missionary and his
two young sons (14 and 9) were burnt alive in his car for allegedly
converting hindus to christianity. Didn't incite riots, but I point
this out because of the talk about conversion.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/264326.stm

Ethnic Cleansing in Kashmir - There have been many allegations of
systematic killings of Muslims by hindu military personnel in Kashmir.

Things that no Indian can possible be proud of.... Also, ATM is right.
You can't believe anything you read on the internet about religious
conflict in India. It's like the China-Tibet affair, almost everything
you see is opinion disguised as information.

The BBC articles I could find are the best in the short time I've
searched. I couldn't find anything for the Babri masjid event because
it's quite old. I'd suggest reading up news articles from decent
sources (i.e. not FOX news) and making up your own mind.... The only
Indian newspaper I know of that prints unbiased news doesn't have
proper archives on website, so I can't point you out to better
information.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Orpheus</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>There is something missing in this puzzle. I refuse to believe its simply a case of cartoon humility. :rolleyes: </DIV></DIV>

images are forbidden in islam. and if i don't misunderstand the 4th commandment, then judaism, and by default, christianity, are also meant to frown heavily upon them;

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth

western culture has decided that "thou shalt not kill" is the biggie, probably because western governments like to keep a monopoly on that. but muslims have an even poorer sense of humour than germans, so they can aford to get heavy on the cartoons.

insulting ANYONE believed in islam to be one of gods prophets would cause problems, even jesus. i remember seeing islamic protesters on the news when 'the passion of christ', a film that had a scene of jesus having a horny dream, was released.

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i eat paint

Actually, the main impetus behind them getting all angry was the fact that it was a picture of MUHOMMED. Not because it was a picture in general. They decry any likeness of the prophet to idolatry, and as such shouldn't be done. They don't want to people to view the image of their highest prophet in an idolatrous way.

Is idolatrous even a word?

Meh.

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Shameless plug.

Damn!! They're burning the danish embassy in Beirut right now... I can't believe all that fuss for some cartoon! Can't they just do a caricature of some viking god???

You know what this means, don't you? The next time we hear of a muslim
doing something naughty (badmouthing Jesus, blowing someone up, copulating etc), we each buy one sack of potatoes and bomb the [insert middle eastern country name here] embassy with them until the buildings are completely buried under mountains of fudge.

Monqui, it's a word.

Addicted to Morphine said:
Monqui, it's a word.

Monqui, is a word. :wink:

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Well you made MSn news.

Freeman said:
Fishy is your second account, isn't he? Good try. But not good enough! :razz:

Although Fishman and I have finally figured out our respective places in terms of our friendship for each other, I find the thought of him being me a bit disturbing.
Please do not even insinuate that again.

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Orpheus said:
<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Freeman</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>

Fishy is your second account, isn't he? Good try. But not good enough! :razz:

Although Fishman and I have finally figured out our respective places in terms of our friendship for each other, I find the thought of him being me a bit disturbing.

Please do not even insinuate that again.</div></div>
damn straight. thanks for telling him off for me, Orph. :kitty:

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i eat paint

spoken like a "true joined at the hip" brother....///runs

Doc B... :dodgy:

but honestly...isnt this one of the most overindulgent scenarios youve seen?...they are just making grounds to pick a fight with a percieved "western" country...i understand to a point, but this borders on the undefendable and ridiculous. bah..... shame on you.