Map Mosaic

With the buzz about the **new** snarkpit and my renewed interest in mapping I've finally sat down and fleshed out a plan to bring back the Map Mosaic Project.

Before I release my "call to action" to the rest of the community I wanted to give snarkpit a heads up.

For those of you who don't know/remember this idea:
The map mosaic is a mapping project inspired by collaborative maps made by VERC members back in the day for HL1DM.
The general idea is to take an empty "template" map, carve it into "tiles" which are distributed to the community who will fill in(map them) these "tiles". Later the "tiles" are recompiled into a finished map resulting in a full map created independently by a number of different people.

WHY? In all my years as a part of the mapping community I see one major trend. The unfinished map. Most people manage to make a single room in what they expect to be a full map, but as we all know that doesn't happen and you are left with a great looking room with not much else going on.

What I want to accomplish with Map Mosaic is a system where people can flex their mapping muscle on a small scale and still see it as part of a finished product.

In the coming weeks I'll release some google documents outlining the design process and work flow of the project. This will include a request for people who are interested in working on the Map Mosaic web site and other related jobs.

If this does spark your interest and you feel that you would be willing to help out with the project please e-mail or IM me (contact info found through my profile).

yeah, so more to come.

So this if for half-life 1?

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Aaron's Stuff

I like it.

Might I suggest something that concerns me? I have no idea about how this will be managed in detail but I would like to see some measures to make sure the final product turns out to be playable.

Like having a very, very simple plan of what part each and every one is making and how they should be connected to make sure the final map has a clean flow (no dead-endish parts etc).

Also this sounds as if it could turn out to be very large in size and I've seen this becoming a problem with many maps (because of both ridiculous file-sizes and kilometer-sized maps that need 12+ players to get any kind of action going). I think it would make sense to have very strict limits in size.

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Why snark works.

Take it from someone who worked on the first Snarkpit collaborative map...

It ain't never gonna be completed. Plus HL2DM and source multiplayer is so not-conducive to the size of map it'll end up being that it probably won't even be playable if it is finished.

Initially I will make the first few template maps, my plan was to make the "tiles" that people work on interchangeable. So the map could be scaled up or down on the fly so to speak.

Later I'd implement a system for user created template maps for HL2DM and other source MODs.

I fell that HL2DM is by far the best option to start working on due to the objective neutral nature of the game play. The first Map Mosaic Beta template map was designed at a reasonable size. Plus there would be semi-strict entity limits.

My feeling is that the only limitation this project faces is lack of people to map the sections. Anyways, more later.

Will the tiles be open theamed?
I think it would be cool to be in a industrial area and the walk through a door and be in a open park.

Side note:
Is is possible the have multiple sky boxes with multiple sky cameras activated and deactivated with triggers?

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Reality has become a commodity.

Unlikely, however you could probably have a single skybox and toggle some func_brushes to change whats in the skybox.

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"If you talk at all during this lesson, you have detention. Do you understand?"

• My yr11 Economics teacher

Imagine a song made by having a half dozen musicians write thirty second snippets that are glued together. You get a much better product by putting them in a room together and having them jam.

Just to let you know DrGlass, I'm interested in joining. I would call myself an intermediate mapper with several years experience (assuming this is the HL1 engine we're talking about).

I'd be interested, but there needs to be like a rubric or something that everyone needs to follow that's quite detailed otherwise it wont work (sort of like the last one).

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Blame it on Microsoft, God does.

aaron_da_killa said:
So this if for half-life 1?

Answer the question dam it :razz:

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Aaron's Stuff

Answer the question dam it :razz:

Learn to read between the lines:

I fell that HL2DM is by far the best option to start working on due to the objective neutral nature of the game play.

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Posting And You

If it is possible to optimize such a large DM map, how are the mechanics of this going to work? Like will each mapper submit their finished section to the man in charge? Or will each mapper take the initiative to "sew" their own map onto the latest version of the mosaic and pass it on? And obviously there will be problems with gameplay, so is the purpose of the mosaic to focus on the aesthetic differences of each mapper's skill and technique and therefore negate gameplay and make this a "show room" of sorts type of map? Or are we making a Frankenstein's monster of gameplay that we zap with players and hope to see it rise from the dead?

I honestly don't see a way to make this a playable map for server rotation. IMO, it would have to be a show room map, as the combination of different styles and isolated gameplay ideas will certainly make "sewing" the parts together too great of a challenge without manipulating someone else's hard work. But I imagine it is possible... Either way, I'm in for creating a small scene for the mosaic!

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Blog: www.playingarchitecture.net
LinkedIn: Eric Lancon
Twitter:@Riven202

Why don't we pass around some map layouts in the IRC channel and discuss it more? The one thing that would never work with a project like this is the general way everyone in this community maps: spontaneously.

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Blame it on Microsoft, God does.

count me in

Something that I found to work nicely in another, quite similar project I once participated in: You let one person start. The starter can build whatever he likes within a week or so. Then the next person gets the map-file and can add a new part (connecting it to the existing architecture). And so on.

This can be repeated until everyone had a shot. Of course, there can be another round for a final pass and further fixes/changes.

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Why snark works.

I'm no mapper, but projects like this are really what makes a community thrive. Go for it, and all you naysayers pipe down. :razz:

So what if it doesn't turn out to be the best map ever created? It's go style, and dammit, it's got love. It's kind of a reminder that everyone's here because they want to do something they enjoy, not because this is work.

I'm a naysayer only because I had a major hand in the first Snarkpit collaborative map that took two years and died at the very last step of development. Everything was done except for weapon placement, but to do that at an acceptable level was, to me, nearly impossible.

The most workable layout to me is a nine square grid, with the middle section done last. Each mapper gets a square or two (depending on participation) and it is passed around in predetermined order where each mapper builds upon the work of the previous. This is done so the map feels connected, even with the different construction styles. The middle section is last so that all the loose unconnected hallways can be wrangled together. Also it helps connectivity, making the map better. I would suggest an experienced mapper for that last piece, cause it is difficult work and not too fun :biggrin: .

If you can't make a playable map out of it I don't see why you'd even bother making it. Gameplay can be preserved by skilled mappers and solid layouts. I'd be willing to help but you guys gotta understand the huge project you're undertaking :biggrin:

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I think examples would help, so here's the first collaborative map. It never had an agreed-upon name but it was the 'snarkpitcrew map' or 'spit' for short (thanks Orpheus... :razz: ).



The order of mapping went something like Grimlock, Yak_Fighter, Orpheus, Alien_Sniper, Dietz, Reno, Alien_Sniper, Yak_Fighter. The construction was organic so there's massive positional differences between many of the sections, with Grimlock's like 3+ stories tall, Alien_Sniper's section at Grimlock's first story, and mine at his third story.



Alien_Sniper wanted a chance to redo his section because by the time everyone finished it had been a year or so and he had improved greatly in skill. After him I wanted a chance to redo mine since there was horrible connectivity between all the sections and Grimlock's and my sections had too many unused connections. So I went through after much delay and like tripled the size of my section to span three stories and connect every other section. (T means teleporter)

upper area:



lower area:



Upper and lower sections connect obviously, but I can't really draw that. Connectivity is the most important part so that's gotta be a major focus point of all the sections. Hopefully if you guys do attempt this you won't end up having somebody want to hang themselves trying to finish it.

I like the input.

This will be for source games (HL2 engine).

I plan to start the project on HL2DM because it should prove to be more flexible with the map out come.

As for complexity, there shouldn't be any. I will have a document dealing with the process done soon for everyone to critique.

An important note: The layout Yak posted isn't the direction I plan to take the mosaic. I want the tiles to be interchangeable (with in reason) and each tile should have multiple people working on it. This will prevent one person from holding up the mapping process.

As for how it will all fit together. Originally I took the time to sew the whole thing together. But I'm confident that a simple script could be written to align all the submitted sections into a single map that would be handed off to a volunteer who would make sure everything works.

again, I'll have some documents on this. While I have always loved the spontaneous nature of our community I also feel that lack of solid planning ruins many projects (mine included). So I'll do my best to keep this alive and moving.

But I'm confident that a simple script could be written to align all the submitted sections into a single map that would be handed off to a volunteer who would make sure everything works.

Am i missing something? Why can't we just turn our tiles into prefabs and drop them into the master.

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Reality has become a commodity.

This has sparked my interest. Heres a suggestion: Would anyone be opposed to setting the map up like tc_hydro in TF2? It would be more along the lines of 2-4 areas being accessible at a time (With a very large entity logic/setup network). This could solve size issues that some mentioned. Plus I think it would just be fun to try mapping again. :smile:

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Posting And You

That's actually a pretty good idea, Omega, I'd like to partake in this one, if i can find time for it and if I can get hammer fixed, I'm still experiencing some bugs, even after putting -engine ep1.
Maybe this could turn into a TF2 map, haven't seen a lot of them around, at least not good ones..

/bump?

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Posting And You

bump indeed, I've just switched jobs and haven't had time to write any documents or fix my PC so I can load hammer. I'll try and get this thing moving in the next weeks.

I'm taking notes of these good ideas also.