New Mod team Seeking HL1 designers!

yak said the same thing i said, only mush better..

reno and jeff, you seem almost as far left extreme as cass and vash were right..

everything you said was spot on, except it was all based off the pretext that there must be a reckoning for all the wrongs this thread has incurred.

if, if.. what a massively understated word..

forget cass, forget vash and forget the new guy.. what is left?? many honest, and either unbiased, or if biased, explained in an unoffensive manner..

forget what i posted even.. you have yak and gollum to draw an opinion from.. both proven defenders of justice.. when justice requires them to do so..

if i might draw your attention to an older post..

Orpheus said:
1st off, the majority was non-admin in support or outright neutrality..

secondly, you are welcome into our world, but i do not detect true sorrow in your "sorry" statement..

thirdly, if this little triad of pages discourages you from remaining.. don't let the door hit'cha on the way out :/

this sums up my perspective..

Granted he probably wouldn't have gotten far anyways given the people here, but he was doomed from the start.

He wasn't doomed from the start, he was doomed from the moment unnecessary and unjustified insults were hurled at him and his mod. Had those not been present, judging from his first post, he woulda been just fine.

So, there's no animosity towards new posters, just morons.

You think he is a moron? Fair enough, you have some justification to think so due to him calling everyone who disagrees with his viewpoint an idiot. However, why does that make him a moron, and cass and vash are perfectly fine getting away with blatant insults (vash calling him a "god damn nerd") without any such judgement?

I don't think any of the issues raised here are the point (/2cents).

I'd be more annoyed at the fact that someone would register, solely for selfless promotion of something - without even a hint of interacting with a community. I've been using forums for nigh on 7 years now, and have come to realise that they exist as an entity, a whole new social community - and people will react just as they would to a person walking into a group of friends and immediately shouting and screaming their thoughts/opinions/messages without taking the time to get the feel of a board/friendship group etc etc..

It's an issue of "netiquette" as it were IMO, and there a few "faux pas's" that have been commited here, but nothing warranting admin action or the sort, more a case of "you live and learn".

P.S. particuarly bad is registering under a "mod/band/clan" name as one entity, always goes down like a lead balloon, at least in my personal experience on the vast intarweb.

ReNo said:

Granted he probably wouldn't have gotten far anyways given the people here, but he was doomed from the start.

He wasn't doomed from the start, he was doomed from the moment unnecessary and unjustified insults were hurled at him and his mod. Had those not been present, judging from his first post, he woulda been just fine.

So, there's no animosity towards new posters, just morons.

You think he is a moron? Fair enough, you have some justification to think so due to him calling everyone who disagrees with his viewpoint an idiot. However, why does that make him a moron, and cass and vash are perfectly fine getting away with blatant insults (vash calling him a "god damn nerd") without any such judgement?

1. I doubt he was going to get many positive responses or offers from people here judging by his initial post, and I thought that was the reason he posted.

2. Vash and Cass aren't going away any time soon, and my personal opinions about them won't make a difference at all in changing the way they post, especially since nobody gives a crap about what I have to say :biggrin: .

Tolerance is the key to community, or something.

Tolerance and more importantly, decency and respect for peoples opinions is the key to a "well lubed" board.. (again, /2cents)

edit: plus obvious small amounts of trolling (from the established condesceding/the permanent troll/the newbie troll) /admin "questions" and "hot topics"/common flamewars.. all the ingredients of a forum

edit edit: plus liberal use of "/" :razz:

Gwil said:
I'd be more annoyed at the fact that someone would register, solely for selfless promotion of something - without even a hint of interacting with a community. I've been using forums for nigh on 7 years now, and have come to realise that they exist as an entity, a whole new social community - and people will react just as they would to a person walking into a group of friends and immediately shouting and screaming their thoughts/opinions/messages without taking the time to get the feel of a board.

To add to that, if the guy had any deep knowledge of the Snarkpit beyond knowing its a message board at an old map review site, he would know that he would probably get very little interest or help from a bunch of burned-out, bitter, old mappers who haven't released anything of merit recently (speaking about myself of course). I don't see a lot of younger people idling around looking for a mod to work on these days here or in most of the HL community.

edit: Kage, whatever man, it's just getting interesting!

/me looks at time it took for topic to hit rock bottom

Only at the snarkpit....

Kage_Prototype said:
/me looks at time it took for topic to hit rock bottom

Only at the snarkpit....

This isn't a pit exclusive problem, it happens everywhere... :smile: when you splice polarised personalities split in opinions, race and background, clashes are bound to happen. I guess we should be glad most of ours turn to structured debates, or at the very least "intelligent arguments" :smile:

I never got all abusive at him or his mod

And I didn't say you did. I was only furthering your statement in an effort to show that attacking somebody so severely based on one forum post is unreasonable.

forget cass, forget vash

Best post yet, Orph :smile:

I was really referring to how we have to debate something so unbeleivably useless.....it tends to happen a lot quicker here than other places I visit....

Gwil said:

Kage_Prototype said:
/me looks at time it took for topic to hit rock bottom

Only at the snarkpit....

This isn't a pit exclusive problem, it happens everywhere... :smile: when you splice polarised personalities split in opinions, race and background, clashes are bound to happen. I guess we should be glad most of ours turn to structured debates, or at the very least "intelligent arguments" :smile:

Which is why there's so much strife and conflict in the real world today! There's too many different ideologies, economic levels, and power discrepancies for real peace. Using the realism theory of international politics, we can plainly see that the forums are in an anarchic state in a multipolar power distribution (not counting the mods), and that will lead to a greater amount of inter-poster conflict. Some posters will ally together in an attempt to increase their power against another foe in an attempt to defeat them, and...

Sorry, I'll stop now.

Edit: Kage, we wouldn't have anything else to talk about. :razz:

Edit: Kage, we wouldn't have anything else to talk about. :razz:

You have a point. These arguments, although pointless, are at least entertaining to read. This is probably why I keep coming back here. :biggrin:

jeff, the hardest thing for me (and i assume everyone) is to forget friendships, where horrible wrongs are concerned..

i think the point here everyone is missing is, allow the new guy, and vash to hash it out.. we seem to have drawn un-necessary battle lines.. there is a history here involving everyone save the new guy..

this doesn't mean he must be abused to fit in, but up to a point he was innocent.. from that point on HE WAS A PARTICIPANT

there was no need to draw lines.. cass is a respected member.. tell him your feelings, not your viewpoint about the new guy.. let the new guy defend himself till the conditions warrant otherwise.

the conversation was "tit for tat" till a few started attacking pit members..

i feel vash and cass erred, i also feel jeff and reno over-reacted..

everyone else.. was very high on the middle ground.. a position all respected pit members should have remain upon..

Well at least me and Jeff evened the teams :biggrin:

Seriously though, if I continue to see such unnecessary newbie bashing, I'll continue to back them up regardless of who slammed them. Its not that I WANT to get into arguments with existing members - I like cass and vash as much as the rest of you (honest) - its just I hate to see unjustified insults being thrown towards people. It presents this community as one filled with assholes, and if that were the case I wouldn't hang around here.

Yak_Fighter said:

Gwil said:

Kage_Prototype said:
/me looks at time it took for topic to hit rock bottom

Only at the snarkpit....

This isn't a pit exclusive problem, it happens everywhere... :smile: when you splice polarised personalities split in opinions, race and background, clashes are bound to happen. I guess we should be glad most of ours turn to structured debates, or at the very least "intelligent arguments" :smile:

Which is why there's so much strife and conflict in the real world today! There's too many different ideologies, economic levels, and power discrepancies for real peace. Using the realism theory of international politics, we can plainly see that the forums are in an anarchic state in a multipolar power distribution (not counting the mods), and that will lead to a greater amount of inter-poster conflict. Some posters will ally together in an attempt to increase their power against another foe in an attempt to defeat them, and...

Sorry, I'll stop now.

Edit: Kage, we wouldn't have anything else to talk about. :razz:

Pfft, your subliminal messages don't work on me, you fiend! :wink:

Orph, I wasn't seriously saying forget them... of course not over one silly thread! I think it's important for people to remember that I'm laughing as I read a lot of the posts in these various debates we have.

I will also defend newbies from excessive bashing, we don't want to be known as a bunch of meanies over here at the pit now do we :smile: (also we don't want to be too nice, allowing a million newbies to flood in :biggrin: )

jeff, we are on the same side of this discussion, i am just handling it differently..

i see all sides, but chose (this time) to stay on the moral middle ground.

Orpheus said:
jeff, we are on the same side of this discussion, i am just handling it differently..

i see all sides, but chose (this time) to stay on the moral middle ground.

Orph? Middle ground? I can see why jeff laughs sometimes.. thats as bad as me singing the praises of mcdonalds and coca cola

puts hands on hips

calling me a liar dear gwil?

point to one reply in this entire thread where i strayed from dead center?

Orpheus said:
puts hands on hips

calling me a liar dear gwil?

point to one reply in this entire thread where i strayed from dead center?

Pfft :razz: me walks slowly away pretending not to notice

I think it was more a reference to the fact your normally firmly sat on one side of an argument, and its novel for you to be in the middle ground instead :smile:

ReNo said:
I think it was more a reference to the fact your normally firmly sat on one side of an argument, and its novel for you to be in the middle ground instead :smile:

i feel it prudent duncan.. without sounding mushy.. thats all i can say.

Damn. I f**ked up. :smile:

I dont get why everyone gets worked up over a few comments. When I posted I was in a bad mood - but nevertheless, I would've post my same viewpoint if I wasnt in a bad mood (expect less offensive). An example of something like this happened when Trigun mod alpha released. We got flamed to hell - but what really pissed me off was that they didnt give us a chance to better ourselves. They saw us as a group of morons looking to make something out of our reach - and that didnt make me exactly happy. Never once in any of my posts, did I say RTKs modification couldnt succeed. I am mad, because Ive seen so many damn Half-Life2 modifications, and people come recruiting for them all the time. I mean sure - its good to be getting ready; but this is just damn rediculous - recruiting a team for a game which doesnt even have a solid release date. Who knows if you'll still be togather when the game is released.

I do not like the idea of RTKs modification, because I never liked the idea of fighting in the future or such. But, that doesnt mean it will be bad. It could be a horrible modification, it could top of the Counter-Strike player records - but I dont play games just because their 'popular'.

/runs away from the smoking hole which this thread is

And yes, I do believe in my right to say what I think in as direct an inflammatory manner as I so choose.

You have the right, but why choose to exercise it? What do you gain from s**tting on someone from a great height? What does anyone gain?

There's a difference between helpful honestly and childish baiting. Your peculiar code of principles seems to conflate the two, and therefore you feel obliged, by the virtue of honesty, to speak your mind when your mouth were better left shut.

...because I never liked the idea of fighting in the future or such

Vash, there are only 3 time zones you can set a mod in - past, present or future. Just because you don't like one of them, does not mean you have the right to call him a f**king nerd for using it.

continues running around screaming

"ME AAAMM, CROICKY"

I guess I'll hit the road like cassius did. I tried to dig myself out of the ditched I forced myself into; only to be nailed in the face with the shovel.

Sorry to 'waste' all of your time this past year.

Gollum said:

And yes, I do believe in my right to say what I think in as direct an inflammatory manner as I so choose.

You have the right, but why choose to exercise it? What do you gain from s**tting on someone from a great height? What does anyone gain?

There's a difference between helpful honestly and childish baiting. Your peculiar code of principles seems to conflate the two, and therefore you feel obliged, by the virtue of honesty, to speak your mind when your mouth were better left shut.

Vash said:
I guess I'll hit the road like cassius did. I tried to dig myself out of the ditched I forced myself into; only to be nailed in the face with the shovel.

Sorry to 'waste' all of your time this past year.

year, is that all its been?

vash, take your licks like the rest of us do.. if you were being picked on and no one helped you, you would be justified.. this time you were in error.. its not as if you make a habit of it..

do what you must, but if you leave, i will rag on you daily till you return...

in fact allow me to begin now, since i will be on the road tomorrow..

PUSS

MAN THAT FELT GOOD :heee:

Vash said:
I guess I'll hit the road like cassius did. I tried to dig myself out of the ditched I forced myself into; only to be nailed in the face with the shovel.

Sorry to 'waste' all of your time this past year.

Well that's the mature way of handling things. :rolleyes: A disagreement is no reason to abandon the community.

Yak_Fighter said:
Well that's the mature way of handling things. :rolleyes: A disagreement is no reason to abandon the community.

ahem

its not?

whistles tuneless melody

lord knows i am the last person to comment on that topic, so i won't :heee:

have i mentioned this yet today, "me aaam,me amm croiky he ett me aaam?"

[edit] with that, i bid you all a fine good night.. /me outa here..

nite/nite guys

all we're doing is looking for recruits. i get flamed instantly by regulars of this site, on our mod premise of all things.. the admins let it go.. I defend my team, throw a crack like idiot back, at those who made the first jabs! and im the bad guy.

It is not I who stepped over the line. i defended myself mildly. true, im new here, but what is this high school? i have to prove my worth, and let harsh insults go? bah

I was not whoring or promoting anything. merely looking for half life designers.. not critiques or uber opinions from elitist sons of bitches.

and im sorry, but this is a half life forum. so here we are. i get met with disrespect instantly. As a side note, this forum of all the forums we've joined in our efforts to find hl1 mappers, has been the most arrogant and self-centered. you should perhaps just make this private ?

i'm clearly out of place here, so truly, no hard feelings. RTk is out. But i personally feel there was a sever misunderstanding along the way, and i hope ya'll wouldnt be the type to hold a grudge. We're just trying to make an enjoyable mod, wether you agree with it or not..

late.

EDIT: reno and a few others, ya'll we're cool.. even if you didnt like the mod, thx.

I may be the only one who thinks this but has anyone noticed that Cassius seemed a lot different than his usual self the last few months? Maybe I'm just thinking too hard into it. But he used to be more, er, serious I suppose. His attitude/maturity seemed to decay over time. Long ago I remember getting help from him, albeit quite gruff and not always correct, but it at least got me thinking. Nowadays it just doesn't seem the same. /confused

i think this new guy needs to take a break, he misread virtually 90% of this entire thread, and in his departing comments still does.

this forum turned itself upside down in his favor.. virtually everyone was on his side, yet he still accuses without thought..

cassius, and vash were wrong, but their thrashing was in vain, cause you missed the point entirely.. many chose you over one of our own.. frankly, you were not worth it IMO, in hindsight any ways..

i say in parting, good luck, and good bye..

rtk-team said:
all we're doing is looking for recruits. i get flamed instantly by regulars of this site, on our mod premise of all things.. the admins let it go.. I defend my team, throw a crack like idiot back, at those who made the first jabs! and im the bad guy.

It is not I who stepped over the line. i defended myself mildly. true, im new here, but what is this high school? i have to prove my worth, and let harsh insults go? bah

I was not whoring or promoting anything. merely looking for half life designers.. not critiques or uber opinions from elitist sons of bitches.

and im sorry, but this is a half life forum. so here we are. i get met with disrespect instantly. As a side note, this forum of all the forums we've joined in our efforts to find hl1 mappers, has been the most arrogant and self-centered. you should perhaps just make this private ?

i'm clearly out of place here, so truly, no hard feelings. RTk is out. But i personally feel there was a sever misunderstanding along the way, and i hope ya'll wouldnt be the type to hold a grudge. We're just trying to make an enjoyable mod, wether you agree with it or not..

late.

Christ go away already. You obviously didn't read 95% of the posts in your own thread.

yak, have you noticed, we have been on the same side of many ordeals of late.. in fact many of our replies look as if we rehearsed them before posting.

cue twilight zone music

i think we need a break, chose something we disagree on.. lets rumble

:cool:

I doubt there's any serious topic that I could get worked up enough about and we disagreed upon to get into a heated argument over.

..bah

rtk-team said:
is it any wonder i dont have time to read 5 replys a minute?

jesus christ ya'll !!

Time to read the few bad replies, but not the many good ones?

Yak_Fighter said:
:cool:

I doubt there's any serious topic that I could get worked up enough about and we disagreed upon to get into a heated argument over.

/me tries..

your grandma wears combat boots..

sticks tongue out in defiance

whispers

i really need to go..

my advice, this case is closed.. we skinned two of our own tonight.. lets rethink our actions, given the hindsight we now possess..

nite all..

Gollum said:

rtk-team said:
is it any wonder i dont have time to read 5 replys a minute?

jesus christ ya'll !!

Time to read the few bad replies, but not the many good ones?

Speed reading is an important skill to have. If you can't skim paragraphs quickly and pull the important topics out with ease then you're going to have a tough time in college.

If you can't/won't read all of the replies, then I suggest you don't make fairly large generalizations that it's all flames - that will tend to instead garner more flames. Anyways, I'm pretty sure the discussion moved away from the mod a long time ago, and is actually the result of built-up tension about HL2 mods in general. Or at least that's how it is for me. Of course, I suppose Cassius and Vash would disagree, but that's okay. :smile:

It has always been my opinion that people don't change when you treat them nicely. Trust me. With all of the things I have done and overdone with this in mind, few have failed. If it's a base policy, it will never touch the idiocy of shutting up whenever someone could disagree with you. And you call yourselves intellectuals.

[EDIT] Jesus, you even made Vash apologize, and you ignored him, just as this post will be ignored. God bless the noobs. [/EDIT]

Cool! We lost two (and probably three in Skeletor) good and dedicated posters defending some guy who wasn't going to stay in the forums and join the community in the first place and has a really f**king stupid premise for a mod. There's a time and a place for defending new people from undue harshness, but this wasn't the right time or place to do it.

:sad:

I don't think I've seen any other situation with such a mild premise get so out of hand ... this is ridiculous, guys.

I hope that both Cass and Vash will come back after they've 'cooled down' a bit; it would be a great loss if either left this community, especially based on this squabble.

Indeed it would be, and if I've caused that to be, then I am truly sorry its occured, but I'm not sorry for anything I've said, I don't take any of it back.

Except perhaps that last reply to vash - he did try to apologize and I did throw it back in his face. In essence, it wasn't my apology to recieve yet I still intercepted it and made it seem pointless, and for that I'm sorry.

This wasn't about defending THIS person in particular, its about general attitude toward newcomers.I hope whats been seen here isn't repeated.

Well, this topic went tits up.

I have noticed the saem thing, Gorb...

the admins let it go

The admins around here don't lock threads of edit posts over something like a small argument (believe me, we have had far bigger than this that didn't get locked), and I believe the place is better for it.

Meh, couldn't be bothered following it really, just seemed like a handful were just giving an instant "omg wtf rtk lamer go away f4g" reaction. Even now I can't be arsed to read this sorry thread, but it would be sad if any trolling people have left. :/