Religion & Tsunamis

Jahzel, I can honestly say I didn't even bother to read whatever bulls**t you're spouting.

You do realize that the government tracks every single computer on the internet and will have undoubtedly already read your posts and sent the men in black to your house. If you're lucky they may just execute you on the spot for knowing too much instead of handing you over to the aliens...

:rolleyes:

PS: Whoever said the US faked the moon landings is going to get a backhand.

Now, back on the topic of Lep trying to convert us all to atheism :razz:

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Yak_Fighter</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>

Now, back on the topic of Lep trying to convert us all to atheism :razz:

</DIV></DIV>

atheism, i though it was continental drift and subjugation 101?
note: i cannot really recall the name, but its when one continent is forced under another.. India is drifting under Asia, hence the mountains to the north.

India isn't a continent? :razz:

I know what you mean though Orph, it's a real issue - but the rate it
travels at (plates etc) is so slow immediate effects are negligible.

I think in about 30000000 years Britain is gonna land in Ontario, something like that.

Subduction, I think?

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting BlisTer</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>the 7 day creation idea is universally accepted as a metaphoric representation only. no one actually believes it took a week.. the number denotes phases, or time frames not "days"
</DIV></DIV>

unfortunatly there are a few narrow minded bible followers that do take it literally. but it has indeed improved with time. just think of the anti-darwinists at the time :/ </DIV></DIV>
I would actually venture to say that fundamentalist belief is far more widespread now than it was in the early 20th century. There aren't a "few" people who believe it. I would estimate that more than a quarter of church-going Christians in this country believe in a literal 7-day creation and a 6,000 year earth history.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting KungFuSquirrel</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Subduction, I think? </DIV></DIV>

Yup.

If you want to look at where the next big earthquake ought to happen it's right here in the northwest. The Cascadia subduction zone hasn't had a big slip in a long time... There is evidence that the Oregon and Washington coastlines have been hit by 300 foot tsunamis in the past. Bye bye Seattle.
I believe the prediction is that the Northwest ought to experience a 9+ magnitude quake within the next 200 years or so. Something like that anyway.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Tracer Bullet</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>

Yup.

If you want to look at where the next big earthquake ought to happen it's right here in the northwest. The Cascadia subduction zone hasn't had a big slip in a long time... There is evidence that the Oregon and Washington coastlines have been hit by 300 foot tsunamis in the past. Bye bye Seattle.
I believe the prediction is that the Northwest ought to experience a 9+ magnitude quake within the next 200 years or so. Something like that anyway.

</DIV></DIV>
i've read this, something to do with the cedar tree's or something as definitive proof of the waves.

PS: Whoever said the US faked the moon landings is going to get a backhand.

ofcourse the moon landing really happened. the thing is, armstrong's camera didnt work, so the government had to film it in a studio... creating all the confusion about wether the landing itself was real or not.

Side note: in belgium we have an interesting phenomena, a guy who is so convinced that the moon landing wasnt real that he literally goes to EVERY music concert/event and wears this sign and talks to ppl about it. and hes on this quest for atleast 6 years. for instance he says terminal velocity cant be reached... hello multi-stage rockets? :rolleyes:

You mean escape velocity. If you want to reach terminal velocity, jump off a tall building. :wink:

he literally goes to EVERY music concert/event and wears this sign and talks to ppl about it.

But what if there is more than one concert/event happening?!

....no wait, sorry, didn't read the being in Belgium bit. :wink:

Nowadays God serves only 2 purposes for the world:

1) A way to justify warped morals (you can always find a handy bible/koran passage that proves without doubt that god wants you to invade a country, or kill some little black people)

2) Something to scream at and blame for things that go wrong, but
ultimately scream for forgiveness and salvation (after ignoring him
previously all your life).

As far as atheists go, they will be the ones screaming for salvation
the loudest, anyone who thinks that they proved to themselves that
something as incomprehensible as a god does, or doesnt exist is either
deluded, or hasnt even thought about it.

A level geology student prespective;

India is a geological rollercoaster. If you look at geological
represetations of the world over time you'll see pangea spliting
slowly, and continents slowly moving into place, respectivly. India has
plowed upwards very quickly, creating these sort of things over time.

There is copious amounts of evidence for a meterior, even two, hitting
earth at the cretatious teriary boundry, causing the mass extinctions
of dinosaurs, there is no doubt that humans could suffer the same fate
as a result of a natural disaster.

( Appologies for spelling, dont have a spellchecker in msie, erw. )

"Jahzel, I can honestly say I didn't even bother to read whatever bulls**t you're spouting."

^ Y' see, the attitude I was basically refering to. Everything I said is provable, admitted, documented, I've read the new 'War on Terror' proposals, I know for a fact they are taking away our human rights and civil liberties as part of this so-called global cackdown on terrorism. You are quick to label it as bullsh*t, which not only is incredably offensive, it's ignorant. Have you ever read Ashcroft patriot act? Do you know your consitutional rights? Well guess what, they are already planning on getting rid of your constitution and your human rights. Guess what, everyone is considered a potential terrorist regardless of class, race, or gender. Does that not worry you? Does it not worry you that the Government are responsible for the terrorist attacks and that they even admit that they carry out them? My friend, you need to wake yourself up.

Back on Topic-ish

Look what I found:

<H3>FORMER U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE REVEALS
POSSIBLE EXISTENCE OF
EARTHQUAKE AND VOLCANO ?WEAPONS?

POSSIBLE?

DEFINITE MORE LIKE


<DIV align=justify>Extracted from
http://thememoryhole.org/mil/cohen-ecoweapons.htm

US Secretary of Defense Reveals Earthquake
and Volcano Weapons

This one might seem beyond belief, but we have it from none other than a sitting Secretary of Defense. In April 1997, then-Defense Secretary William Cohen was speaking at a terrorism conference at the University of Georgia. After some introductory remarks about the conference, Cohen takes questions from the media in attendance. A reporter asks a question based on the fake anthrax letters that had recently been sent to B'nai Brith. Cohen gives a strange answer, using the occasion to mention the exotic weapons being developed by terrorists (as well as--one would assume--governments).

Here's the exchange, taken verbatim from the transcript posted on the Defense Department's Website:

Q: "Let me ask you specifically about last week's scare here in Washington, and what we might have learned from how prepared we are to deal with that (inaudible), at B'nai Brith."

A: "Well, it points out the nature of the threat. It turned out to be a false threat under the circumstances. But as we've learned in the intelligence community, we had something called -- and we have James Woolsey here to perhaps even address this question about phantom moles. The mere fear that there is a mole within an agency can set off a chain reaction and a hunt for that particular mole which can paralyze the agency for weeks and months and years even, in a search. The same thing is true about just the false scare of a threat of using some kind of a chemical weapon or a biological one. There are some reports, for example, that some countries have been trying to construct something like an Ebola Virus, and that would be a very dangerous phenomenon, to say the least. Alvin Toeffler has written about this in terms of some scientists in their laboratories trying to devise certain types of pathogens that would be ethnic specific so that they could just eliminate certain ethnic groups and races; and others are designing some sort of engineering, some sort of insects that can destroy specific crops. Others are engaging even in an eco- type of terrorism whereby they can alter the climate, set off earthquakes, volcanoes remotely through the use of electromagnetic waves.

So there are plenty of ingenious minds out there that are at work finding ways in which they can wreak terror upon other nations. It's real, and that's the reason why we have to intensify our efforts, and that's why this is so important."</DIV></H3>
As for religion, I've got nothing against people who want to believe in something, but I know for a fact that religion was once created as a mass brainwashing device aimed at discouraging free-thinking abilities. "Its against God's will to free-think." "Free-thinking is a sin".

"If the FBI's motivating factor for busting down the Koresh compound was child abuse, how come we never see Bradley tanks smashing into Catholic churches?" - Bill Hicks.

You call a vague reference by a political official evidence? We don't even understand earthquakes well enough to accurately predict their occurrence, let alone control them. Do you even know what electromagnetic waves are? Did Cohen? From your statements I highly doubt it. If this is the kind of fact you rely on, I can begin to understand the preposterous conclusions you might come to.

And changing the weather? people have been trying that forever, and there are even scientists today who believe it is possible, but if you take a considered look at the energy requirements it simply isn't feasible. A quick calculation will show you that it would take the detonation of a very large nuclear weapon to say, change the air temperature of a 20 kilometer radial area by 1 degree Celsius. This is precisely the sort of change that climate models predict is necessary to influence things such as hurricane patterns.

People, please!

KFS, proton decay is something that's meant to happen on timescales of tens+ of billions of years- certainly not within the lifetime of our sun. By which time hopefully we'll be able to create binding gluon fields or some such to keep them in one piece :razz:

Yak, I'm not trying to convert anyone, I'm not good enough at that yet! A couple more years training here though... :biggrin:

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Anything that questions 'the official line of events' in detail is always subject to mass ridicule, labelled as some kind of conspiracy, you get called a conspiracy kook. It's usually mainstream media and so-called education which makes sure that this attitude stays firm within the minds of the populous. It doesnt even matter if there is proof, if it is documentd, admitted, none of the truth is excepted, only rubbished.</DIV></DIV>

... because 99.9% of the time, it is just that. It's nothing to do with mainstream media- go work for a newspaper and you'll notice there isn't some shady government man post-editing your stories to keep the masses calm and content. Go work for the government, and there isn't some Knights Templar telling you to start a war against so and so to start a new world order.

Governments like controlling people, and they will often spout complete bulls**t to get their way (in case you haven't noticed already). The only people who will have the technological might to alter climates and set off volcanoes etc. are, er, those with big piles of nuclear warheads. And given Iraq et al, do you really think they're competent enough to orchestrate terrorist attacks against their own people and "get away with it"? Can you imagine any organisation of hundreds/thousands of people organising something like that with no word getting out? Remember these are people at the top, not super intelligent evil robots.

And yes, a lot of things are strange and are counter-intuitive, such as dodgy looking moon landing photos. But at the end of the day, think about what's more likely and what has more evidence to back it up, and, importantly, realise that you don't know everything about circumstances (how the hell do you know how moon dust/gravity/etc. influences photographs?). I used to be in the exact same shoes as you and believe in faked moon landings, aliens, etc. etc. but after years and years of absolutely nothing turning up and more debunking going on than proof, chances are these things are just the usual nonsense that crackpots have been going on about since culture began, and scaremongering.

So basically, stop looking for ghosts until one hits you in the face and you can do something yourself to prove it!

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Orpheus</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>
<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Yak_Fighter</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Secondly, I'd say that the US is undergoing another religious re-awakening

</DIV></DIV>

side note: i have noticed this too. i have real issues with churches the size of shopping malls going up everywhere, yet people are still hungry. i have issues with my tax dollars helping put them up, and i have REAL issues with them not paying taxes on the building and whatnot.

most of this i have heard through the rumor mill, so i am not positive about the tax parts.

the way i see things going, its a last ditch effort to re-instill the fables and pagan belief system into the newer generations. i have met good people, and bad people, but being religious never signified which you would be. in fact i have met more genuinely evil people whom profess religious beliefs. shrugs

anywho's, i do however believe that natural disasters make you wonder about your place in the scheme of things. no one wants to face their mortality. and when its driven home so strongly as when something in nature takes a punch at you, people tend to look for the easy way out.
i know they will never outlaw religion, but i sure wish the people would wise up and smell the coffee. :sad:

</DIV></DIV>

Atheist?
I know you said how you "weren't going to rehash religion" because you've already said your thoughts... but you may want to rehash it, or else there may be some major confusion!

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting G.Ballblue</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>
Atheist?

</DIV></DIV>
agnostic... i confuse myself, what difference is it if i have company?

An article from today's LA Times:

*****

CATASTROPHE IN SOUTHERN ASIA

Some See God's Hand in Remade Landscape

1. Believers point to intact religious structures as evidence of a force

far greater than waves. Was the devastating tsunami a warning from on
high?

By Mark Magnier, Times Staff Writer

TALPE, Sri Lanka ? At the moment he was running out of air, trapped
underwater with his head held down by a slab of concrete and his body
repeatedly slammed by the surging tsunami, Evan Russell Kern called to
Jesus to save him.

His appeal, the born-again Christian said, was answered almost
immediately: The concrete broke apart, and he reached the surface.

Here in nearby Talpe, the Starlight Inn hotel suffered only minor
damage ? mud on the veranda and a few branches in the dining room.
Structures for miles around were devastated.

Owner Ginthota Polwattage Susil Asoka, a Buddhist, attributes the
near-miracle to the good karma he has built up over a decade of charity
work.

"Before, people weren't sure there's a God, but now they are," said
Mohammed Nazar, a Muslim businessman in the town of Galle. "God has
brought great floods as a warning. Whether you're a Buddhist, a
Christian or a Muslim, this is a sign to live according to your
religion."

Even as global news networks detail the science behind the Dec. 26
earthquake and tsunami using multicolored graphics and detailed
timelines, many Sri Lankans who lived through this catastrophe see the
work of a force far greater than some powerful waves.

Frequently heard at devastation zones are the echoes of an Old
Testament-style God who rewards the deserving and smites the unworthy,
lashing out at corrupt rulers and punishing those who have abused
nature in their headlong rush for wealth.

"Buddhists believe it's very important to keep a balance," Asoka said.
"Nowadays, so many hotels in Sri Lanka pollute and dump garbage into
the sea, so the sea is taking its revenge."

Even those whose belief in religion has waned admit their brush with
this much raw power, which killed more than 30,000 people in Sri Lanka
alone, has forced them to reexamine their view of faith and
spirituality. New Zealand tourist Simone Grace, 32, said that as she
fought for her life in a swirl of glass, knives and blunt objects after
the waves roared through her hotel in Unawatuna that morning, she found
herself engaged in a profound internal debate.

"In those 10 seconds facing death, I really thought hard about whether
I should or shouldn't revert to religion," said Grace, a lapsed Roman
Catholic, as she sat beside a stone statue of the Hindu god Ganesh.

Grace, who works in costume and film production in London, said she
decided against a last-minute conversion, though the disaster had left
her mulling weighty questions about death, life and her place in it all.

Organized religion provides solace to many, she noted. Still, she'd
rather not be part of something that can divide people and engender
intolerance.

"I'd just say I believe in a universal force," she added.

Malskaer Lispegh, a 47-year-old Danish resident of Unawatuna who ran a
motorcycle rental business before the tsunami washed away all the
bikes, said she had felt more vulnerable since surviving the waves by
climbing on a rooftop and pulling her 12-year-old son to safety by his
long hair.

"I've started to think, what's wrong with our global system, and why
has so much pain fallen down on Sri Lanka?" she said in a friend's
washed-out living room. "While I'm not a member of any organized
religion, I find myself praying to something out there for help."

All that's a bit too ethereal for many Sri Lankans, who live in a
society in which people are generally known by their religion, and the
local temple, mosque or church tends to be the heart of their community.

Many locals' faith has been redoubled by what they view as evidence
that the waves seemed selective in their destruction, sparing most
religious buildings and icons. While structural engineers argue that
religious buildings are typically bigger and better able to withstand a
tsunami's fearsome power than ordinary houses, others here insist their
survival in apparently great numbers is God's handiwork.

In Galle, concrete and plaster statues of Buddha, legs folded and
expression serene, sit with barely a scratch amid piles of rubble. In
Mullaittivu, statues of saints remain on the parapet of an otherwise
destroyed seaside Catholic church. In Talpe, although the glass case
around it has shattered, a 7-foot, orange Buddha at the Meegaha
Dewalaya Temple appears untouched.

"Every place we go, the Buddhist statues are without damage," said
Lionel Eerasinghe, a coordinator with the Sri Lanka Foundation, a civic
group. "People believe they have special protection."

Many temples, mosques and churches have reported a surge in attendance.
At the Kataguda Jumma mosque in Dewata near Galle, the number of people
who attended prayers on the Friday after the tsunami swelled 30% to
2,000, said Imran Uwais, a teacher there.

"We don't have enough room," he said. "The wave is a curse, and people are getting the message, at least for now."

Asoka, the businessman, said Sri Lanka must take collective
responsibility for what's happened. The country was once known as the
Pearl of the Indian Ocean for its prosperity and sophistication.
Recently, he said, it has lost heaven's mandate because of its corrupt
leaders and greedy citizens.

"It's a warning to people to behave themselves," he said.

Edit - Fixed (Gwil)

The public started to question the war in Iraq and the so-called weapons of mass destruction so they go ahead and try to plant them themselves, their plan obvioulsy was foiled.

There whole agenda is full of flaws and they know it. They weave in and out of their lies to try and avoid attention. Mainstream media makes sure the public are about as ill-informed as it gets, and believe, as I've seen today, it works.

The globalists know people are eventually going to wake up and be outraged at their blatant attrocities. For this reason they made sure that we live in a time of 'terror threats' and such which make way for a global police state, and that anyone who opposes must surely be a terrorist and a threat to national security. I mean this is stated in the Patriot Acts I & II and Homeland Security, 'any act of misdemenour that endangers lives' is an act of terrorism. And now they are saying these 'terror' crimes need life imprisonment. This is admitted! They are saying that, this is also in the proposals, that 'any one who criticises government policy should be charged as a terrorist for being a potential threat to homeland security'. Whistleblowers are being sent to prison or executed for uncovering corruption. You can be quote 'secretly arrested, secretly tortured, secretly executed if you endanger Homeland Security. Even the word 'Homeland' is synonymous with Nazi Germany.They also have 'compact camps' to send you to if you disagree with the governments policy. Neo cons all over will agree with this proposal, it's ridiculous.

Now they're going round harassing members of public threatening to arrest them under homeland security legislation. The thugs in police attire are going round tasering people, folks have died, they tasered a guy in a wheelchair who 'needed to be detained', they have tasered children as young as 6, cs-gas sprayed young babies! This is in the mainstream news. This is terrible.

You may sit there and go 'oh well, doesnt bother me, I've got nothing to hide, I'm not a terrorist, I agree with what they're doing if it means we're going to be safe', but in a few years time your human rights will be taken away, your freedom as a citizen completely abolished, your activities monitered daily, your DNA on a national database etc. This is not a war on terror, this is a war on our freedom and civil liberties. You need to wake up and stop ignoring these issues and get yourself free from this paradigm. This is important stuff that may benefit the lives of your families and friends and generations in the future.

Anyway.

"Mass murderers agree; Gun control works."

Sounds terrible.

Good job you don't live in America really.

#

Oh by the way, don't you realise that tapping into this train of
thought, whatever it is is just the same as "blindly following the
government"?

Theres a big train called irony and it's heading down your way. Who's really been brainwashed?

... because giant bronze statues weighing several tonnes are really going to be washed away or destroyed, along with the stone mosques standing around wooden shacks, and because all those other people who prayed to Jesus/whoever in their last minutes were saved :rolleyes:

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>the 7 day creation idea is universally accepted as a metaphoric representation only. no one actually believes it took a week.. the number denotes phases, or time frames not "days" </DIV></DIV>

or if people were interested enough to try and piece together a history that has been fragmented into various religions/myths, they may find that a very similar [but much older] story of creation was known in ancient Sumeria, that has been found on stone tablets that come in sets of seven. Moses being a temple priest in Egypt, which had it's roots in Sumerian culture, he was well aware of the original creation stories. the book of Genesis is the end result of these stories being passed down through 6000 years, sometimes by no more than word of mouth, and sometimes worse, by bad translation.

A wee statue of Ghandi survived in India too, and that was pretty flimsy/unprotected.

Indeed, it is just coincidence - I bet a ton of smaller mosques/temples were washed away.

Who's really being brainwashed? Anyone who believes that we are fighting against terrorism and that we need a national DNA database and biometric fingerprint scanning to win the war on terror. Also anyone who hasn't even bothered to investigate the Patriot Acts I & II, Homeland Security, PNAC, and FEMA proposals yet claims that it is all bullsh*t and nothing to be worried about. When the same proposals are trying to be launched in this country, UK, then yes it is worrying - especially when we have now seen the introduction of the UK Bill of Rights, almost identical to the American Patriot Act, also the new 'compulsary' ID cards that 'help the good guys fight against the bad guys'.

I'm sick of this mindless, unthinking, unquestioning attitude polluting innocent minds through mainstream media and religion. Irony, brainwashed, I think you are not picking up on what I am talking about. I do not follow a Government that plans on introducing a global police state - a global Nazi Germany. I oppose all formsof Govermnet tyranny and corruption and so should you, infact so should everyone. As a matter of a fact, you seem unconcerned about your life in the near future and the lives of others. And if you want to carry on smirking about this then do so. Just remember theres only one window of oppotunity available to expose the New World Order agenda and if we do not do so now we will never win this good fight. It's in your court.

Who's really being brainwashed? Anyone who believes that we are
fighting against terrorism and that we need a national DNA database and
biometric fingerprint scanning to win the war on terror. Also anyone
who hasn't even bothered to investigate the Patriot Acts I & II,
Homeland Security, PNAC, and FEMA proposals yet claims that it is all
bullsh*t and nothing to be worried about. When the same proposals are
trying to be launched in this country, UK, then yes it is worrying -
especially when we have now seen the introduction of the UK Bill of
Rights, almost identical to the American Patriot Act, also the new
'compulsary' ID cards that 'help the good guys fight against the bad
guys'.

I'm sick of this mindless, unthinking, unquestioning attitude
polluting innocent minds through mainstream media and religion. Irony,
brainwashed, I think you are not picking up on what I am talking about.
I do not follow a Government that plans on introducing a global police
state - a global Nazi Germany. I oppose all formsof Govermnet tyranny
and corruption and so should you, infact so should everyone. As a
matter of a fact, you seem unconcerned about your life in the near
future and the lives of others. And if you want to carry on smirking
about this then do so. Just remember theres only one window of
oppotunity available to expose the New World Order agenda and if we do
not do so now we will never win this good fight. It's in your court.

People aren't brainwashed, they're lazy. There's a world of difference.

You just got squashed by that Irony train, dude, and you don't even know it. :razz:

You should get used to the idea that there is such a thing as chaos, mistakes, and random natural events. Not everything is part of a grand unified scheme to screw you. If you think about it, your point of view is rather egocentric.

Jahzel, delusional just does't seem strong enough a word.

And to lash on the irony further, isn't the essence of this conspiracy
theory the same that was at the heart of the Nazi desire to gain power

• ie an international conspiracy of governments and jews.

Same s**t, different wording.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Jahzel</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>The Globalists have always sought to develop a one world government, a global fascist state. This agenda has been happening for years, and if you open your eyes you should see that it is nearing completion. Now that the Middle East is under Globalist control because of the so-called 'War on Terror', other regions of the world affected by the disaster are now going to be under Globalist control. The Red Cross, those who are in charge of 'saving lives' will keep most of the funding as they did post 9/11.</DIV></DIV>
Yeah, and Valve leaked HL2 on purpose to increase sales and take over the universe!!!!!111 ONE ONE ONE OEN EON EOI I KNOW ALL ABOUT IT

CONSUMERISM AND MEDIA ARE OUT TO EXPLOIT YOU!

No s**t, it's called capitalism and market economy - and this guy
http://www.davidicke.com/ , is laughing all the way to the bank by
exploiting people still living in the age of the X Files.

I could write any old tripe and link it randomly up with international
events of past and present, and write books just like this guy.

Oh BTW it wont help coming back with conspiracy theories - we are just
the mindless, brainwashed masses, after all. We believe in the
government.

God the irony is seeping out to dangerously high levels...

I saw a good conspiricy thing on sky one a few months back. It was talking about people who have aparently decoded the bible by taking every 5th letter and seeing what it comes up with and there was one bit that they had "decoded" and it said something about some one coming into power and trying to take over the world (it didnt say that exactly but thats what these "experts" took it as).

now one of those "experts" has decided to do the tora and he says that he found a passage that says the world will end next year so either I can beleve him and not give a s**t about this govermental tyranny or vise versa.

This show was quite interesting I didnt beleve a word of it but was still quite interesting they also did one on the new world order and it just made the people that beleve in them look like crackpots.

OMG!!! Cass is onto something. maybe it was the fat controller himself that developed the new physics engine to make the earthquake bombs...........................

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Gwil</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>CONSUMERISM AND MEDIA ARE OUT TO EXPLOIT YOU!

No s**t, it's called capitalism and market economy - and this guy http://www.davidicke.com/ , is laughing all the way to the bank by exploiting people still living in the age of the X Files.

I could write any old tripe and link it randomly up with international events of past and present, and write books just like this guy.

Oh BTW it wont help coming back with conspiracy theories - we are just the mindless, brainwashed masses, after all. We believe in the government.

God the irony is seeping out to dangerously high levels...

</DIV></DIV>
I wish I had the balls to write stuff like that. I could make a fortune in pseudoscience!

I'm going to go study Deus Ex now, just so I'm prepared. It's like Warren Spector saw the future and is communicating it to us through a first person shooter... I really can live the future, today!!

Well, OK, listen, I'm not going to waste my time trying to tell you about the New World Order. You're obviously treating the whole thing like one big joke, that's ok, that's for your own enjoyment, but it do you or your family and friends any favours in the near future. It's inevitable, it's like a trigger mechanism that generates ridicule. Sa the words 'New' 'World' 'Order' to an unsuspecting crowd and they will laugh, just as they are condtioned to.

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
"And to lash on the irony further, isn't the essence of this conspiracy theory the same that was at the heart of the Nazi desire to gain power - ie an international conspiracy of governments and jews.

Same s**t, different wording."

[/quote]
Yes, and the same techniques used by the Nazis as well as other dictatorships are still being used today. They are effective in that they delude the population into thinking that their 'saviour' (i.e. Adolf Hitler, George W Bush) is here to save them from evil. It worked and millions were enslaved in Nazi regime.

And yes it is the same sh*t different wording.

<UL dir=ltr>
[*]
<DIV>[color=#ffcc99][color=white]On Feb 27, 1933 [/color]Hitler Burned the Reichstag to consolidate [/color]centralised federal police power and undermine the German Constitution and take many of the freedoms of the German people.</DIV></LI>
[*]
<DIV>
On Apr 19, 1995 the explosion of the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City, helped Clinton to get his 2nd term as president. AND centralise federal police power and undermine the American Constitution and take many of the freedoms of the American people.

</DIV></LI>
[*]
<DIV>
On Sep. 11, 2001, The Destruction of the WTC in New York and Washington, DC, helped Bush centralise federal police power and undermined the American Constitution and took many of the freedoms of the American people. In fact, the USA Patriot act power grab, makes Hitler look like a piker.

</DIV></LI></UL>
The next day after Hitler Burned the Reichstag, he used that as an excuse to round up his opponents and have them shot. Then he Issued his BIG DECREE, JUST LIKE THE CLINTON ANTI-TERROR LAWS, AND JUST LIKE THE BUSH PATRIOT USA ACT, THAT WAS SIMULTANEOUSLY PASSED IN THE OTHER 15 "USED TO BE FREE" NATIONS OF EUROPE AND AUSTRALIA AND NEW ZEALAND.

HITLER WAS GIVEN POWER TO RULE BY DECREE. IT WAS BY LAW AN ACT OF TREASON TO SPEAK AGAINST NAZIS. Did you hear what happened to those [size=13][color=white]who turned their back to Bush as he addressed the OSU commencement? [/size][/color]

Let this be a warning to everybody; If you want to ignore the facts then prepare for a new Global Nazi Germany to emerge.

Cry about it why don't you.

There's no way Bush could become a Hitler-like dictator and hold power, considering the massive size of the US population and landmass, the wide variety of differing opinions and stances people hold, the lack of homogenity among the people, the incredible strength of the US economy, the number of guns owned by normal citizens, and the 50-50 split in the voting.

These are facts, that is reality. Pull your head out of your ass please.

you know, i dunno which is scarier, a thread less than 12 hours old is 84 replies long, or that some of the replies have scroll bars to read them with :/

you people, you can go on about the most mundane topics i swear. it would be refreshing to have one just once, thats important. truth, i dunno exactly what that topic will be, or could be, but this one..... :rolleyes:

perhaps, its diminished because its all over the place, and doesn't stay true for more than one reply..

carry on gents.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Jahzel</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>
Let this be a warning to everybody; If you want to ignore the facts then prepare for a new Global Nazi Germany to emerge.

</DIV></DIV>
How soon? I'll get my tin foil hat ready.

Like I say, I could if I wanted to pull this apart, but I haven't the heartlessness :smile:

Also, your facts on Germany are skewed at best - how do I know? I studied it for 8 years (another reason why I can't be arsed to be drawn in on a debate with it as one of the issues).

You believe what you like, and we will believe what we like - but given
there is no hard, factual evidence to back any of it up i'll stick with
a normal, healthy dose of cynicism. The administration is crooked, and
misaligned with most people in every country.

It's called politics, and politicians - most people dislike them,
everyone thinks they can do a better job, but it's hardly cloak and
dagger stuff.

And some people just use their social pariah status to write books
about conspiracies that don't exist, to make a fast buck. Wake up and
smell the coffee :smile: You're being swindled by the very techniques this
man seeks to demonise and accuse everyone else of.

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
"There's no way Bush could become a Hitler-like dictator and hold power, considering the massive size of the US population and landmass, the wide variety of differing opinions and stances people hold, the lack of homogenity among the people, the incredible strength of the US economy, the number of guns owned by normal citizens, and the 50-50 split in the voting."

[/quote]
Yak, for this reason, the next agenda follows:

<UL dir=ltr>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Weakening the US Dollar. eventually there will be an economic collapse to force the world into a global electronic currency.</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Taking away the Constitution and the right to bare arms to protect yourselves and your families (already in the anti-terror proposals)</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Using the Patriot Acts I & II and Homeland Security to arrest anyone who is a suspected terrorist, i.e. a threat to a global fascist dictatorship</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Arresting anyone who frequently refers to the constitution (actually admitted)</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Arresting ant-war/anti-bush protestors and sending them to 'compact cities', FEMA concentration camps that they already have set up for dissidence</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Using Electronic Voting a means to manipulate voting figures. There has been a general outrage over voting fraud and it is a wonder the US didnt do exactly what the Ukarainians did. </DIV></LI></UL>
All I'm asking you, and it's not much, is to read up on this stuff. Go to www.infowars.com, go to www.prisonplanet.com, listen to the interviews, watch the footage, read the documents, be informed, fight this New World Order and global tyranny, and never give up.

P.s. Your avatar states that you must know about George Orwell's 1984. Well just look at what he had to say back then! Look at today's world of 'terror threats; and surveillence! For god's sake, what we are facing today is ten times worse than 1984.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Jahzel</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>Well, OK, listen...


...Let this be a warning to everybody; If you want to ignore the facts then prepare for a new Global Nazi Germany to emerge.

</DIV></DIV>

I don't quite see why you keep on ranting and raving about the U.S. if you don't live here. If I'm not mistaken, European countries have fewer civil liberties than we do, more police/government power, and much tougher gun laws. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that you are an American, and have just put your location as "UK" to throw of the globalists who might be dogging your heels. You don't write like a Brit, and that's a fact. But whatever, it doesn't matter.
I have been decrying your ignorance, but on second thought, I think I'm glad you don't know anything about science. I shudder to imagine my technical knowledge and imagination in the hands of someone so obviously ungrounded in reality.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Jahzel</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>
<UL dir=ltr>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Taking away the Constitution and the right to bare arms to protect yourselves and your families (already in the anti-terror proposals)</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Using the Patriot Acts I & II and Homeland Security to arrest anyone who is a suspected terrorist, i.e. a threat to a global fascist dictatorship</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Arresting anyone who frequently refers to the constitution (actually admitted)</DIV>
[*]
<DIV style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">Arresting ant-war/anti-bush protestors and sending them to 'compact cities', FEMA concentration camps that they already have set up for dissidence</DIV></LI></UL></DIV></DIV>
These ones are just ridiculous. Republicans do not want gun control. I won't even begin to speak about your Global Facist Dictatorship. When has Bush arrested anyone for referring frequently to the constitution? - and if he did, when did he admit to it? I have many friends and a few family members that have been in large anti-war protests, they have not been sent away to 'concentration camps;' nobody has.

You have frighteningly little conception of what life in the US is like.

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
http://www.prisonplanet.com/archive_police_state.html

[/quote]
Read for yourself about the removal of the 4th Amendment, read about Atty. Gen. John Ashcroft's announced desire for camps for U.S. citizens he deems to be "enemy combatants", read about the quiet monitering of anti-war protestors and new 'free speech zones'. I'm sure you and your family and friends may well have escaped detention, but soon the new laws will toughen up and anyone will be targeted by these vultures.

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetext>
in the hands of someone so obviously ungrounded in reality.

</DIV></DIV>

</DIV></DIV>
speaking of which, i have been telling my wife, holds index finger and thumb 4 inches apart this is 6 inches for 23 years now. :wink:

Go here and read the Globalists proposals:

http://www.newamericancentury.org/ (Project For A New American Century - PNAC)

Some interesting quotes that show that I'm not making this whole new world order thing up and that it has been the grand design of the future for years. P.s. Sorry for hoggin up the forum with this one:

<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
"The world is governed by very different personages from what is imagined by those who are not behind the scenes." --Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli of England, in 1844.

"The Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) is the American Branch of a society which originated in England ... (and) ... believes national boundaries should be obliterated and one-world rule established."-- Professor of History Carroll Quigley, Georgetown University, in his book "Tragedy and Hope".

"Some of the biggest men in the United States, in the field of commerce and manufacture, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they had better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it." - Woodrow Wilson

"[The New World Order] cannot happen without U.S. participation, as we are the most
significant single component. Yes, there will be a New World Order, and it will force the United States to change it's perceptions." -- Henry Kissenger, World Affairs Council Press Conference, Regent Beverly Wilshire Hotel , April 19th 1994

"David Rockefeller is the most conspicuous representative today of the ruling class, a multinational fraternity of men who shape the global economy and manage the flow of its capital. Rockefeller was born to it, and he has made the most of it. But what some critics see as a vast international conspiracy, he considers a circumstance of life and justanother day's work... In the world of David Rockefeller it's hard to tell where business ends and politics begins" . Bill Moyers

"We know in the not too distant future, a half dozen corporations are going to control the media. We took this step (merger) to ensure we were one of them"--Time Warner spokesperson.

"We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it. The only question is whether World Government will be achieved by conquest or consent." -- Statement made before the United States Senate on Feb. 7, 1950 by James Paul Warburg ("Angel" to and active in the United World Federalists), son of Paul Moritz Warburg, nephew of Felix Warburg and of Jacob Schiff, both of Kuhn, Loeb & Co. which poured millions into the Russian Revolution through James' brother Max, banker to the German government - See the Siss?on Report

"All of us will ultimately be judged on the effort we have contributed to building a NEW WORLD ORDER."--Robert Kennedy, former U.S. Attorney-General, 1967.

"The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise their power from behind the
scenes."-- Justice Felix Frankfurter, U.S. Supreme Court.

"I am concerned for the security of our great nation; not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insideous forces working from within." -- General Douglas MacArthur

"For some time I have been disturbed by the way the CIA has been diverted from it's original assignment. It has become an operational and at times a policy making arm of the government." --
President Harry Truman

"The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government of the U.S. since the days of Andrew Jackson."-- U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt in a letter written Nov. 21, 1933 to Colonel E. Mandell House.

"The real menace of our Republic is the invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy legs over our cities, states and nation."-- Mayor (1918-1925) John F. Hylan of New York.

"Fundamental Bible-believing people do not have the right to indoctrinate their children in their religious beliefs because we, the state, are preparing them for the year 2000, when America will be part of a one-world global society and their children will not fit in." --Nebraska State Senator Peter Hoagland, speaking on radio in 1983.

"When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of freedom to Americans..." "And so alot of people say there's too much personal freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it. That's what we did in the announcement I made last weekend on the Housing Projects, about how we're going to have weapon sweeps and more things like that to try to make the people feel safer in their communities"--President Bill Clinton 3-22-94, MTV's "Enough is Enough"

"We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans.."--
Bill Clinton USA Today--3-11-93, page 2a

"Gun registration is not enough"--Attorney Generral Janet Reno--12-10-93--Associated Press

"Waiting periods are only a step. Registration is only a step. The prohibition of private firearms is the goal"--Janet Reno

"If a nation values anything more than freedom, then it will lose it's freedom; and the irony of it is that if it is comfort and security that it values, it will lose that too. Unknown Americans must decide : Are we to be governed by Americans or by an International organization ? I, for one, owe no alliegence to the United Nations nor will I give it any. I obey only the U.S. Constitution. You had better think about this issue, for if the U.N. can violate the Sovereignty of Haiti, Iraq and other countries, it can violate ours...The United States may not be the top dog 15 years from now. U.N.
security council resolutions, backed by say chinese soldiers, could be aimed at us."-Charley Reese-Orlando Sentinel

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, the New York Times, Time magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected the promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world-government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the National autodetermination practiced in past centuries"--David Rockefeller in an address to a Trilateral Commission meeting
in June of 1991

"From the days of Sparticus, Weishaupt, Karl Marx, Trotski, belacoon, Rosa Luxenberg and Ema Goldman, this world conspiracy has been steadily growing. This conspiracy played a definite recognizable role in the French Revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the 19th century. And now at last, this band of extraordinary personalities from the under- world of the great cities of Europe and America have gripped the Russian people by the hair of their head and have become the undisputed masters of that enormous empire."--Winston Churchill to
the London press in 1922.

"The Trilateral Commission is intended to be the vehicle for multinational consolidation of the commercial and banking interests by seizing control of the political government of the United States. The Trilateral Commission represents a skillful, coordinated effort to seize control and consolidate the four centers of power--Political, Monetary, Intellectual, and Ecclesiastical."--U.S. Senator
Barry Goldwater from his 1964 book "No Apologies"

"I believe that if the people of this nation fully understood what Congress has done to them over the last 49 years, they would move on Washington; they would not wait for an election....It adds up to a preconceived plan to destroy the economic and social independence of the United States!"
--George W. Malone, U.S. Senator (Nevada), speaking before Congress in1957.

"The invisible Money Power is working to control and enslave mankind. It financed
Communism, Fascism, Marxism, Zionism, Socialism. All of these are directed to making the United States a member of a World Government ..." -- AMERICAN MERCURY MAGAZINE, December 1957, pg. 92.

[size=10][color=white]"The Air Force is suffering from pilots who have lost faith in their generals, jet engines that still don't work after repairs and maintenance depots with 'little quality or quantity of work being produced', according to an internal Defense Department memorandum. The draft memo paints a troubling picture of the state of American air power. 'The sad state of air-force readiness can be blamed on the Clinton Administration, which treats the military as a toy to be deployed for meals-on-wheels-type missionswithout due consideration for it's impact on readiness", said Robert
Maginnis, a [u]retir

sigh a long post anyways , according to the last book of the bible, it
talks about the ending of the world correct me if i messed up anywhere
u bible quoters = P , There will be 8 years with an ultimate dictator
the first four years he will show himself to be a good leader ,
christian & loving. But in his last four years he will show his
evil & his twisted lies . he will show himself to be the
anti-christ. He will create an oposing trinity , Antichrist, his
assistant, & satan who will try to destroy Iovah by trying to
unite all the humans souls. . :wink: correct meh if im wrong anyways tell me
if you find any similarities to any past occurances or recent occurances

btw one of ur quotes dates back to the day my GRANDAD WAS BORN 1919!

I read about half of that, which I think is more than most people.

1. Isolated quotes are a pretty stupid form of evidence. I could probably give you isolated quotes from all the same people that would categorically deny most of those positions. After all, they are politicians. Sadly, I'm not devoted enough to this discussion to go to the effort.

2. Practically all of these have, obvious, distinctly non-sinister interpretations. And for those that seem truly whacked, I can easily write them off as either nutty people, or simply statements out of context. For instance, why is it odd that Bill Clinton and Janet Reno were rabid anti-gun agitators? They are liberals. get over it.

3. Why is a New World Order a bad thing? I suppose it would be if it were a truly a police state, but I don't think that will happen. Eventually there will be a planetary government, but it will come in the fullness of time, long after I am dead most likely. There are many changes that will need to occur before that can happen, such as the global equalization of living standards etc.

I don't even know why I'm bothering to continue this "conversation"

Wait, four years of being a good leader? Phew, we're safe. :wink:

As for this "New World Order" business: Yes, there is a new world order. We're in a changing time, and the world will not be as it is now in 10, 15, 20 years. Just as it is now far different from what it was in the 60s, 70s, 80s, etc. etc. But a few dozen quotes with the phrase "new world order" in it isn't proof of any grand master scheme - hardly any view of what this new world order is/will be matches! You've got political, economic, corporate, religious, many of which conflict with each other. Hell, to the quotes from the 40s and 1800s, we are the new world order in this far, distant, and unpredictable future.

I know this is going to sound funny and outright stupid, but if any of you have Knights of the Old Republic, go have a listen to Jolee's ramblings on things. There's some wisdom there, despite it being just another scripted line in a video game. I'll have to see if I can dig up the line.

some of these quotes have absolutly nothing to do with the topic you posted....

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quoting Tracer Bullet</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>I don't even know why I'm bothering to continue this "conversation"</DIV></DIV>

because you suffer from the same affliction i do. you cannot tolerate miscommunication of any type, especially when the other party is so far off base.

i am not saying whom is right in this instance, but the sides are very distinct in how the topic is viewed by each member.

you, like me, cannot end by just walking away. it stinks of cowardice, or worse.

in my case, the more someone insists i am being an asshole, the more motivated i am, because to me it indicates they have no clue as to the truth of the matter. i have met real assholes and i am but a shadow compared. the more the other person insists, the more wrong they become.
anywho's.. thats my take on why people continue, when all reason says "whats the use?"

Yeah maybe that's it...

Orpheus said:
<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetitle>? quote:</DIV>
<DIV class=quotetext>

<DIV class=quote>
<DIV class=quotetext>
in the hands of someone so obviously ungrounded in reality.

</DIV></DIV>

</DIV></DIV>
speaking of which, i have been telling my wife, holds index finger and thumb 4 inches apart this is 6 inches for 23 years now. :wink:

This had me in stitches by the way