Now listen, somthing has come to my attention. Are you ready? Are you Sure? Ok ok geez.

There is a new trend in Video Games now these days. Most developers are trying to remove all in game cinamatics and have everything going on in first person. Developers which shall remain un-named are boasting about how they are moving everything in first person and think they are so cool because they are.

Apart from the fact that there is no advantage of having everything in first person, it sucks ass. The player needs a time where he can take his hands of the keyboard and reflect on what he/her has just done, wether it be shooting the s**t out of some monster or breaking a super hard, annoying code. Things can also be made out to be soooooo much more dramatic in movie sceanes as opposed to crappy-appy first person action. And Sweet angles which cant be shown in the first person can be shown in cinamatics.

I'm not saying to get rid of first person action, I'm just saying that those developers are bragging. They think there so good ....

So what do you think? Can you add some extra pro's and con's to either? Am I wrong? Huh ? Huh? Oh and vote.

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Aaron's Stuff

Gaming should be about playing a game, not looking at all the pretty colors. Cutscenes should come at the end of a level, like Painkiller's, or, if necessary to complete the level, should be in-game.

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Also change the texture of the dock. Docks are rarely tile. -Facepunch
As I Lay Dying

Yea, I know, but you have to create atmosphere man. Cinamatics have the potential to create awsome atmosphere. And also, there is nothing wrong with haveing cinamtic scenes during levels. What if there is a big twist in the storyline during the level?

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Aaron's Stuff

I think a game should be of whatever you are willing to pay for. I mean, I despise consoles, but would never think of banning them because if someone wants to play them, its not my place to care if they do.

Same goes for any game. If there is a market, there should be someone out there developing it for it.

Uhh, what was the question again?

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The best things in life, aren't things.

cinematics is like when you open up your actionman present on christmas morning, and find that it didn't come with the remote control hovercraft that it was advertized with.

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i eat paint

Didn't you just hate it when your parents didn't catch the small print: "1-9 volt battery required. Battery not included"

And all the stores were closed for Christmas.

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Yea, I know, but you have to create atmosphere man. Cinamatics have the potential to create awsome atmosphere. And also, there is nothing wrong with haveing cinamtic scenes during levels. What if there is a big twist in the storyline during the level?

More than anything great level design is going to generate awesome atmosphere, you don't need fancy cinematics to do that for you.

My opinion:
Cinematics are great for setting up a situation or leaving you out of one. Aka: Halo's "Silent Cartographer" level where your flown into an island, it wasn't elaborate, but it did its job to explain how you got there. Anything that breaks the gameplay is terrible though. I guess if you want to be lazy or sit there and contemplate a story situation, well theres been a great invention! Its called the PAUSE BUTTON, you press it and you can sit there and contemplate all you want. You don't need cinematics to do that for you.

and without further ado - A post from the future:

future post from aaron_da_killa said:
Geee okay guys cool. lolz. (halo 2). I wuz just asking cuz I wanted 2 know (halo 2) wheather youz guyz leiked cinematics more tehn 1st person shooter (halo 2) cinematics so I know what to put in my n00b tastic mod teh red dawn (FART halo 2 lolz) thats 200 maps of full bright ugly ass maps that are filled with fart jokes, that my other st00pid friends thought was awasome because they're exactly like me.

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Posting And You

I think first person cinematics are good, if they are used right.(like in hl2?)

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Step back, citizen!

I didn't vote because the only options are black, white, and Nietzsche.

My answer is: they're two different ways to tell a story in a game, both work well when executed well. The developers 'bragging' probably stems from the fact that historically there haven't been many games to create a truly cinematic immersive first person experience.

@Omegaslayer:
That post incited me to bump my rating of you up one notch. :wink:

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o

Youre a funny man arn't you omegaslayer. Well see who's lughing when my mod is released. Its going to destroy everything out there. You know my brother walked in the room, looked at the screen and said "Playing half-life2 are ya". He thought I was playing half-life2 but i was just playing my mod, which is using the half-life 1 engine. He's no dumbass. He likes half-life 2 more than me man and he thought I was playing it when it was my mod , I have also had 2 testers tell me that its better than half-life1 and 1 tester tell me its better than half-life2. I only have 7 testers. They have not said anything negetive, other than this. This is what Alex one of the testers said: "You should make the light destryable" Thats about the most negative thing that people have actruly said about my mod, who have played it. Why dont you pm "tz" and "gears_of_war_man". There not testers but they have played builds of the game and there not biased. But dont worry, If I saw a noob crap on about a game and his mod, I'll give him s**t to. I dont blame you omegaslayer, just keep a look out for news on the mod. :cool:

Back to buisness. They did do the first person cinamatics in half-life 2 well didn't thay. I agree. But omegaslayer, the pause button breaks the flow of the game. You'll have to get back into the right frame of mind. Thats annoying. And nice work for the halo referance.

edit: Looking back at omegaslayers impersonation of me, which is strangly funny, I have totally ditched the idea of 200 maps. I was such a noob back than and reddawn, and its story have changed so much. And my maps arn't full bright. They used to be about 1 year back when I made my first multiplayer map, (included with reddawn) but know, omg. I have hit so many barriers with the half-life1 engine, all have been broken through though. For example: I have hi-resoultion (1024x768 +) textures in the game. And much much , much more, all with the half-life 1 engine. Broom broom.

I'll see you soon >>>

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Aaron's Stuff

A bit of advice Aaron. The Kings English is the same where you live as here. Use a spell checker.

Its no sin. I use one... Well maybe it is a sin, but I still use one. :wink:

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Yea I know I should. Ok lets see. Hello Mr Bond. Cool the snarkpit.net spell checker is awsome. From now on I shall use the spell checker. Its not a sin.

No I changed my mind. Its sucks, I mis-spelt awsome on purpose and it did not have the right spelling. Better than nothing though. Anyway whats your real name orph. Seeing as my real name is obvius.

edit: omg, i just downloaded the Half-life1 sdk 2.3 and have no idea at all what to do with it. Its learning time for da_killa

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Aaron's Stuff

It's a cinematic whether is first-person or third-person. There's nothing special about doing it either way...if it sets the scene how the game is to progress then i'm all for either/and/or.

Kind of an invalid poll really.

And 1024x768 textures in the HL1 engine - that just made my day...

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You Got To Get Through What You've Got To Go Through To Get What You Want But You Got To Know What You Want To Get Through What You Got To Go Through

Its true hawkins. At first the game crashed a few times, but now I have found a way around it. And there not 1024x768 for nothing either. Although there 256 colours (8 bit) its safe to say that there as detailed as the half-life2 textures with the video settings on high.

Havn't seen you lately hawkins. But I know who you are.

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Aaron's Stuff

aaron_da_killa said:
Havn't seen you lately hawkins. But I know who you are.

Nope. You prolly don't.
This is that other Hawkins. Smart and not in a wheel chair. :razz:

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Yeah, Hawkins is the guy who has commented on everysinle tut on this site. I swear. And orph, whats your real name?

edit: I noticed somthing about omegaslayers impersonation of me, again. My freinds are not like me. One of them is a nintendo nutcase, and is totally anti-halo. One of them Hates Nintendo but thinks Gears of War is better than Halo. One of them Think Consoles rule the world. One of them think Pc's rule the world. Who else is there? Oh yeah, one of them love racing games, one of the is a kiss-ass-sony-person. One of them is very quiet and does not speak much, and loves valve and steam. There all unique. And some of them arn't my freinds there in the industry.

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Aaron's Stuff

Real name is Jon.

Just keep it to yourself as I don't want it known on the web.

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Ok No worrys. All I want know is your last name, telephone number, email and address. Uhh got ya, I got ya, dont panic I'm only kidding.

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Aaron's Stuff

Youre a funny man arn't you omegaslayer. Well see who's lughing when my mod is released. Its going to destroy everything out there. You know my brother walked in the room, looked at the screen and said "Playing half-life2 are ya". He thought I was playing half-life2 but i was just playing my mod, which is using the half-life 1 engine. He's no dumbass. He likes half-life 2 more than me man and he thought I was playing it when it was my mod , I have also had 2 testers tell me that its better than half-life1 and 1 tester tell me its better than half-life2. I only have 7 testers. They have not said anything negetive, other than this. This is what Alex one of the testers said: "You should make the light destryable" Thats about the most negative thing that people have actruly said about my mod, who have played it. Why dont you pm "tz" and "gears_of_war_man". There not testers but they have played builds of the game and there not biased. But dont worry, If I saw a noob crap on about a game and his mod, I'll give him s**t to. I dont blame you omegaslayer, just keep a look out for news on the mod. :cool:

First off - spell check (http://www.mozilla.com/), I can barely read what you write. Granted English might not be everyone's first language here at the pit, but I do believe you Australians can speak English.

Im holding my stance of saying: Unless I see some screens of this "ground breaking mod" im just going to say that your shooting this out of your pie hole. It takes years of a team of ~10 people to come up with something truly unique (http://www.hl-nightwatch.net/ -- unfortunately they had to quit because it was too much). Now your telling me that you + your brother are comming up with a ground breaking mod? This setting off anyone else's bull s**t alarms?

I noticed somthing about omegaslayers impersonation of me, again. My freinds are not like me.

By that I meant that they are biased towards their own cause. They don't have open minds as to the vast world of gaming, and just limit them selves to 1 platform. I think most of us here at the pit play all variety of games, whether it be the original doom, to SNES Zelda, to STALKER we all have open minds as to what is truly great, unlike you where you say Halo 2 is absolutely greatest game of all time.

I will not PM your friends and ask them for myself, because for all I know its you in disguise. And just because "some guy" without any form of credit here at the pit tells me something is good doesn't mean im going to believe them.

Alls im saying is if you want to be taken more seriously here at the pit by its members, take some screens of your "mod" and showcase them. We understand the concept of "work in progress". But words saying "this mod is going to be ground breaking" is just empty....

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Posting And You

Dunno how you can code if you can't spell.

My freinds arn't me. Why do you say that. Tz is a dude called tim, and gears_of_war_man, is a good freind.

Also I know how hard it is to make a mod. I have almost quit so many times, but than I finish somthing that has been stressing the crap out of me or I figure out somthing that I have always been trying to do, than I play the build of it, and I see how good-quality the thing is. Man thats what drives me to do more work.

Also you can expect to see some screen shots of the mod soon ( you may even spot some easter eggs, or this may be the first time you have seen real fog in half-life1), very soon. But so far I'm planing for the mod to be about the length of Half-life 2 Episode 1. Its a few years down the track still but who knows, it may even break off from the half-life 1 engine and become an independent game.

I'm also working on a demo for the mod, which I'm hoping to be released this year, so I'll tell ya all when thats coming. And i'll check out that link you gave me to see what I am up against.

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Aaron's Stuff

/me douses you with gasoline and flicks a lit match in your direction

We don't care about 10,000 free* smileys.

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o

Please remove that spam spyware s**t from your last post.

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SourDough2.0 - With Strawberry Jam

lol. <div><embed src="http://plugin.smileycentral.com/http%253A%252F%252Fsmileys.smileycentral.com%252Fcat%252FF%252Ftransport.swf%253Fcode%253DF%252F1%252F436%2526partner%253DZSzeb110%255FZS/transport.swf" loop="false" quality="best" bgcolor="#ffffff" width="100" height="120" name="transport" align="middle" allowScriptAccess="sameDomain" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" wmode="transparent" flashvars="code=F/1/436&partner=ZSzeb110_ZS" />
http://www.smileycentral.com/?feat=prof&partner=ZSzeb110_ZS"></div>

I wonder if that works. If you have no idea what I' target=_blank m talking about then it didn?t.<A></A>

edit: wow

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Aaron's Stuff

Aaron.. You're upsetting some pretty influential members.

I'd advise caution.

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The best things in life, aren't things.

What the? Are you serious. Who and how? You mean omegaslayer?

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Aaron's Stuff

aaron_da_idiot said:
Who and how?

Who? Baron von snickers and me.

How? By posting that spyware spam s**t.

GET RID OF IT.

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SourDough2.0 - With Strawberry Jam

I'm influential?

@aaron: How? Come on. Seriously... I mean come on, seriously. :rolleyes:

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o

Put whats wrong with having extra smileys. I got it off orph anyway because I was having a look at the first snarkpit forum posts and I saw orph adding them. Wait a second, i'm very serious, is there an add at the end of my post. Please I'm not jokeing. Mabye thats what you think it is. Becuse when Orph had these similys I saw a strange add. I'm so sorry if there is. Its not my fault.

edit: http://www.snarkpit.net/forums.php?forum=1&topic=116&17 go there

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Aaron's Stuff

Firstly, stuff like that is s**t.

Secondly, looking at the old post I miss/remember CCS's dancing Donkey Kong.

Yeah I'm over the smiley's already. And it takes to long for them to load up. I'll use the snarkpit ones. :biggrin:

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Aaron's Stuff

aaron_da_killa said:
Put whats wrong with having extra smileys. I got it off orph anyway because I was having a look at the first snarkpit forum posts and I saw orph adding them. Wait a second, i'm very serious, is there an add at the end of my post. Please I'm not jokeing. Mabye thats what you think it is. Becuse when Orph had these similys I saw a strange add. I'm so sorry if there is. Its not my fault.

edit: http://www.snarkpit.net/forums.php?forum=1&topic=116&17 go there

if you'd read through the whole thread, you should have seen that using the plugin would put big spyware ads at the ends of your posts, so there's no point in blaming Orph.

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i eat paint

Oops, it wasn't ment to sound like I was blameing Orph. That came out wrong.

Anyway Orph is a dinisour

edit: Is there any spyware advertising s**t in this poast at all? Even if there are any links? The bitch program has super glued itself to ie. I'll have to restart in safe mode and have a direct war with the thing,... later.

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Aaron's Stuff

Its a few years down the track still but who knows, it may even break off from the half-life 1 engine and become an independent game.

Ohh my god, don't make me laugh.

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Posting And You

Rule of thumb: Whenever you see the word "Free" on the internet be suspicious of all links and downloads on that site, don't download anything unless you see a credible license agreement, and virus-scan anything you download.

There is no such thing as free, someone pays for it somehow, often it's advertising companies paying to show you (and everyone in the forums you post at with the plugin) ads and links to spyware, or advertising companies paying for your email address, browser history, everything you type including passwords, credit card numbers, etc etc etc.

FYI

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o

omegaslayer said:
Ohh my god, don't make me laugh.

You were specifically saying this in reference to the quote, right? I seriously want to make you laugh, and want to be sure that there won't be any negative ramifications for trying.

Failing that, can I talk bad about your sister? :heee:

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The best things in life, aren't things.

Failing that, can I talk bad about your sister? :heee:

Feel free too.

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Posting And You

Baron von Snickers said:
There is no such thing as free, someone pays for it somehow......

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i eat paint

which is more like real life? a pause with a long video, or real time debriefings and such

i'm gonna go with the lack of pauses

omegaslayer said:
Feel free too.

Well if you're gonna be that way...

You sister, dresses like a girl. She prolly even sits down to pee. I bet, she even plays with... DOLLS!

Take that.

\runs

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The best things in life, aren't things.

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Aaron's Stuff

Re: Cinematics

I have no problem with opening and closing cinematics. They are awesome, and can do alot for the game

Now, cinematics elsewhere... it really depends on how its done. Nothing pisses me off more in a game, than being in the middle of a fight, and then there is a level change/cinematic/etc
On the other hand, if done well so as to be SEAMLESS with the game, they can be pretty nice

Anyways, I voted 3, because your poll is black and white when my answer is a shade of grey

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Signature? What signature!?

Yeah I agree with you fjorn. They have to be perfect. Now dont get angry with me but the only game that I know of with perfect cinamatics is Halo and Halo2. Please thats all I know of, with perfect cinamatics. Any developer against those type of cinamatics must be a little wacky. And If they brag about how there not in there "project" then there a bad developer. Tsch. You cant bag out somthing that is good, even if you dont like it. :smile:

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Aaron's Stuff

I'll tell you a little secret...Halo and Halo 2 really aren't that good...and the cinematics are no different to those found in ten dozen other first-person shooters. :wink:

Move on mate, expand your horizons and don't worship just one game.

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You Got To Get Through What You've Got To Go Through To Get What You Want But You Got To Know What You Want To Get Through What You Got To Go Through

Seriously man, its not like Halo is dead, It has a massive, massive following, very active halo2 xbox live players, and I cant wait to see how bungie Will "finish the fight" to this brilliant trilogy. The Halo serious has won many awards and even has a few records.

And my horizens are pretty large. They have to be to like Zelda, sort of. I go now.

P.s can you folk see this

<TABLE style="FONT-SIZE: 8pt" cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="100%">

<TR>
<TD vAlign=top align=middle></TD>
<TD></TD>
<TD align=middle></TD></TR>
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<TD align=middle>

</TD></TR></TABLE>

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Aaron's Stuff

The hype about everything being first-person rather than cut scenes came from Half-Life using this method to create an experience that is superior to any game released before. I guess most games today, bragging with their lack of cut-scenes, are just trying to copy the HL hype. Yep, still today.

But that doesn't make the games better or worse. It's all about how well either is done.

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Why snark works.

The cinematics in STALKERS is done well.
As much as i like halo myself, the single player was lacking.
I don't own a x box. Nor will i never ever own vista so i will never play halo 2 but i have herd they took all the skill out of the game.
Plus halo pc is not what it used to be. It's glory days are past and now i mostly find severs full of 10 year olds. You can tell because all they do is charg head on and shot. They have no concept of tactics. It's hard for me to find a challenge now days (rarely that i do play anymore though). It's not fun coming first every time.

I like the first-person, "active" storytelling of Half-Life, but I wouldn't want all games to go for that style. You wouldn't wanna play FFXII or Vagrant Story without cut-scenes, and on the flip side I don't want them making an appearance at all in Geometry Wars or Forza Motorsport. Different styles of cinematics suit different gameplay experiences. If your game requires long (or at least significant) conversations or periods of scene-setting it might be pretty damn boring to restrict the view to the player's camera. Likewise, many games further their storyline through multiple angles (eg. "meanwhile, inside the enemy base..."), which is impossible to do if you are restricting the view to through the player character's eyes.

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[img]http://card.mygamercard.net/sig/Default/reno84.png[/img]
Designer @ Haiku Interactive | ReNo-vation.net

I fink you should learn to spell.

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What the Snarkpitters listen to!

Yeah you all are right. I am only aggainst developers who belive cut scenes are bad. Because they are not bad, the developers who say that are. Am I right :dodgy: .

Also I fink I can spell, I just said it like that for some lovin,.. :shocked: did I just type that?

edit: Can you see my picture I posted 5 posts up or my second last post. I'm asking because I followed rumples advice on how to post pics and I wanna see if you guys can see it

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Aaron's Stuff